Possible Olympus FF dilemma....what will they do?

captura wrote:

Tom Caldwell wrote:

captura wrote:

Tom Caldwell wrote:

Common sense says it is for Olympus to decide.

Sony announced some time ago that they were going to concentrate on FF sensors (presumably for their own products) but it has to reflect on the pricing of sensors for other brands that use Sony sensors. Chances are that it will be as cheap to fabricate FF sensors as smaller ones. Not that they will be cheaper - just more profitable to make and use in large quantities.

Tom, this is true. But the somewhat radical manager responsible for a lot of changes within Sony seems to have fled the scene, for whatever reasons. Maybe the Old Guard have returned to the palace? If so, the first sign of a reversal of policy may be the A6300, and other new Sony APS-C bodies may follow. Maybe.

Canon and Nikon, and Pentax for that matter. Made/make dslr bodies that have both aps-c and FF alternatives and without reading the badges it is often hard to tell the difference. So a naive user can be quite happy with the great images they can get with their kit dlslr body with aps-c internals and matched lens. I cannot say that I ever worried which of my dslr bodies took that great image whether it was aps-c sensor based or FF sensor based. It was either good enough or it wasn't and I was quite as able to make a bad image with my FF 5D as I was with another aps-c body.

So this all gives the lie to the great urgency by some to get a FF sensor camera body in their hands. It is driving the industry along a track where popular myth will see it go in yet another direction. We have had even more megapixels forever on tiny sensor until even the totally naive user could work it out. We have had bridge cameras with impossible crop zoom lengths until incredulity met common sense.

Lenses are mulled over at great length far beyond the average user's capability to tell the difference. Even 1" sensors can produce images that almost anyone can relish. Mobile phones can produce images that amaze me.

Me too.

So we are being hauled down the track kicking and screaming until we all admit that only a FF sensor might do - even if we don't need one.

I wonder what the next myth will be? I give Sony full-frame marketing credit for this one.

The Sony NEX series was only ever made because Sony saw an opportunity to make a hopped up replaceble lensed compact camera and so that philosophy has remained even though the product has matured into an effective aps-c based product. On the other hand the A7 series was just a rather crude bodied replication of a dslr theme which had to have lots of buttons and wheels no matter how awkward they were to use.

Back then, I was running a G1, an E-PL1 and a NEX-3 at the same time.

So the Sony approach is different and because of this "interesting" we have their aps-c camera body style that is basically simple compact with supercharged components and their FF contibution which is basically worked over 1990's slr with a big engine and terrible brakes and steering - but "what a ride" as long as you can make it around corners ....

Actually I still use a NEX-7 which I am fond of. Especially the 'tri-navi' controls. Still a good 24 mp cam for landscape and portrait work. It doesn't get noticed like my E-M10.

Credit where credit is due.  I have a NEX6 which I quite like using.  Nice interface (mostly) but quite basic - the only camera I have ever had where I have run out of things to assign to even its limited set of functions and button. I set the screen magnify to the ael lock button which does wonders when a soft shutter press destroys it in the middle of a delicate manual focus exercise.

Maybe they would have done better with slipping the FF sensor into a NEX style body as many Sonyites thought might happen. The NEX style is easier to use. On the other hand I would not be at all surprised if Sony took a leaf out of the Canon/Nikon book and made an entry level A7 lookalike with an aps-c sensor. That the MkII has gone up-market in pricing leaves room for a cheap aps-c version for the naive masses to play "proper cameras".

For a while there was a rumor about an A9000 body which was exactly that. A hopped-up NEX body with a full-frame sensor. I believe it might have been there in the prototype stage, but then the GM of the time put a hold on all new 'skunk-works' developments of the time, which were not his own idea.

Sony never stopped developing new APS-C sensors for anyone who wanted them, and more recently, some new M43 sensors too. Their sensor division is a completely autonomous entity.

Steve

There is a certain amount of hand-wringing over the prospect of Olympus abandoning the 4/3 sensor for FF as much as they happily dumped the 4/3 mount in favour of the M4/3 mount some time ago.

My technical antennae would suggest that the M4/3 mount has a good head of steam in the boiler and will not be left in the lurch as long as significant sales are made. This must happen as long as there are a wide range of lenses purpose made for the mount. That Olympus is still allocating resources to making new Pro-level M4/3 mount lenses shows that there is nothing in their thinking along the track of the prospective end of the m4/3 mount system. This is their volume product that gives them market share and the money engine to run the whole show.

This leaves the rumours. In my mind it would be common sense for Olympus to consider a limited foray into the FF sensor territory. These cameras would be premium high priced bodies for those whose ambitions will never be sated until they have a FF sensor inside the box. It will stop the drift to Sony A7 series from M4/3 and a marketing shot across the bows of any move by Canon or Nikon into a pro level FF mirrorless body.

In other words a FF Olympus must be an inevitable happening but more to protect their existing market share from slippage.

They can do it by seeking a premium price market in small volumes - they are likely to price in the Canon 5DRS or Sony A7R MkII region - where they can sell relatively small numbers of camera bodies and lenses at prices that will make regular M4/3 fans eyes water. But there will be enough dry eyed Olympus fans willing to pay the entry price to FF sensor to make it worth doing for Olympus even if their lens range is small and also very expensive.

For those that might suppose that Olymous will start a FF body price war I suggest that they forget it - the only way that Olympus can make such a move is by way of a small volume - high priced product for those that will pay anything and carry any size just to have that magic FF sensor inside.

An E-M1 body might well handle a FF sensor - whether the existing M4/3 mount itself could also do this I leave in the hands of the optical experts.

What Panasonic might think of this antic might be something else. I might suggest that they might concentrate on the area that M4/3 does best and make very high quality cameras in the GM series all no larger than the present GX7. Why fit a 4/3 sensor in a camera body and then make the body as large as a FF sensor Sony A7 series?

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Tom Caldwell

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Tom Caldwell