The iconic sports car gets an electrified option as part of the 992-generation refresh.
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Porsche builds a hybrid 911 at long last
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103 lbs over the previous Carrera GTS Coupe. I should add that to the text.
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Damn that's a nice hybrid design and well out of my price range. Have to say tho the major detractor is the lack of buttons for the center console. I heartily wish that the automotive engineers would bring back the damned buttons knobs and switches.
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This is not a plug in hybrid, it still burns fossil fuels for 100% of its energy. It may use slightly less of that, but that's doubtful due to driving style.
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There's a bunch of physical controls right there in the photo. Looks like climate control and a volume knob at least, which is all you really need.
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If this car comes along with that crisis I'll add my meltdowns to the Holidays section of the calendar.
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That’s one very densely packaged power unit. Anything more than routine service looks like it would be a drop-the-engine nightmare.
I wonder how they keep heat from the exhaust turbine from killing that closely-coupled electric MGU?
I wonder how they keep heat from the exhaust turbine from killing that closely-coupled electric MGU?
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The automotive world seemingly is going a bit sideways on the journey towards decarbonization. This, obviously, isn't designed to be a particularly 'green' thing. It may get marginally better gas mileage, at the expense of slightly more weight and ? more carbon inputs on manufacture. Of course, the number of these vehicles that Porsche will sell is even less than a drop in the bucket of climate change or anything else.
So, Ok, this is technically interesting. Which is to a large degree what Porsche and other niche manufacturers do but....
And Toyota, which tends to be more mainstream is going all out on a turbocharged very mild hybrid for it's bigger trucks. Which, again, yields some fuel efficiencies and on a percentage basis, significant improvements, but hardly needle moving. Mostly it seems to be to increase horsepower and overall performance with a side helping of the electrification yielding some technical improvements (traction control, etc.) At the cost of a bizarrely complex powertrain. Yeah, that's Toyota with a history of getting-it-right but still, they screw up from time to time.
So it is an interesting journey. Pure BEVs are still moving. Slowly. The initial foray has been a bit disappointing on many levels. But this is a long haul issue so giving it some time is important.
I just would not have guessed that a major push would be mild hybrids (with no pure EV mode) compared to PHEVs.
So, Ok, this is technically interesting. Which is to a large degree what Porsche and other niche manufacturers do but....
And Toyota, which tends to be more mainstream is going all out on a turbocharged very mild hybrid for it's bigger trucks. Which, again, yields some fuel efficiencies and on a percentage basis, significant improvements, but hardly needle moving. Mostly it seems to be to increase horsepower and overall performance with a side helping of the electrification yielding some technical improvements (traction control, etc.) At the cost of a bizarrely complex powertrain. Yeah, that's Toyota with a history of getting-it-right but still, they screw up from time to time.
So it is an interesting journey. Pure BEVs are still moving. Slowly. The initial foray has been a bit disappointing on many levels. But this is a long haul issue so giving it some time is important.
I just would not have guessed that a major push would be mild hybrids (with no pure EV mode) compared to PHEVs.
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It's a 911. It'll be gas powered until the last oil well has been plugged and there are no more waste polymers to break down into base hydrocarbons and resynthesize back into burnable fuel. It'll probably be literally the last car on Earth to go full EV, and I think it's more likely they'll just discontinue it and launch a new 2+2 EV.
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Darn! After 5 years I just paid off my 911, got the pink slip, and felt really satisfied because there was no other vehicle I wanted. Now I’m thinking again.
But the back seat is already a cruel joke, even though I need it once in a while, and the “frunk”, which my GF reviles, has to be getting even tinier with that traction battery. One reason I opted not to get all-wheel drive was because that also squeezes storage space.
Any idea how much (or if) the mileage improves? I can get 28-30mpg in my base Carrera on the highway without trying too hard and still having fun.
But the back seat is already a cruel joke, even though I need it once in a while, and the “frunk”, which my GF reviles, has to be getting even tinier with that traction battery. One reason I opted not to get all-wheel drive was because that also squeezes storage space.
Any idea how much (or if) the mileage improves? I can get 28-30mpg in my base Carrera on the highway without trying too hard and still having fun.
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I'm curious to hear the performance improvements, given that the hybrid/electric motor seems to be more for performance gains than increasing fuel efficiency.
Edit: For the new GTS, Porsche says zero-to-60-mph acceleration drops from 3.2 to 2.9 seconds. Street performance sees the most gains, with that electric motor really picking up the slack from the slight turbo lag at the lower rpms.
Edit: For the new GTS, Porsche says zero-to-60-mph acceleration drops from 3.2 to 2.9 seconds. Street performance sees the most gains, with that electric motor really picking up the slack from the slight turbo lag at the lower rpms.
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It'll be gas powered forever. Porsche already has a pilot plant to make gasoline from co2 in Chile so they never have to stop using it.
edit - https://www.caranddriver.com/news/a42295419/porsche-efuel-water-car-fuel-chile-production/
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I get you, but this car is all spring and fall Saturday-afternoon drive, not a commuter car for the masses. Dreams, a fantasy for all but the one percent. I agree Toyota is the one who could make the affordable EV that would make the difference in our children’s’ asthma and our cities’ brown clouds. Instead they are wasting time on hydrogen and wrecking the family space in the Prius. They won’t even make enough RAV4 PHEV so one can just go buy it. And how about Mazda — Where is my Miata EV? Why can’t we get the ID Buzz California in California, home of #VanLife?
Perhaps other car makers will be inspired to at least create better light hybrids because adding five or ten miles to the gas millage shouldn’t count for anything.
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It's not going to help on the highway. Maybe a bit in stop and go traffic. I think I've read elsewhere that they're aiming to improve performance, more than anything.
The setup does look pretty neat. Since there have been rumors that the next Miata will be "electrified", I hope it ends up with something like this. Technology should be pretty polished and affordable by then and getting something proportional to a 50hp boost at the cost of 50kg (since it's a smaller and lighter car) is a no-brainer. The Ferrari hybrid systems seems to work great by all accounts.
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It sounds like the next Miata won't be until 2030. By then they will probably go straight to BEV.
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The article says the traction battery is the same size as the old 12V battery, and the new 12V battery is a small LiOn unit under the parcel shelf, so no space lost.
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Riding out the ND for 15 years would be quite impressive achievement, though they kind of pulled that off once with NA/NB. I think it's going to be sooner.
Batteries are just batteries. You can buy new, refurbished, or make your own replacements. Look at the Prius for example. You can get a 1.5kWh LiFePo4 pack for like $150 right now. Obviously not a suitable replacement for this 400v pack but in 15 years I'm sure you could just order one from Aliexpress for $50 or something.
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Toyota now has a hybrid for their small truck as well. I'm kind of in the market (OK, the thinkaboutit stage) and it's pretty interesting compromise. Want a light truck, should buy something more practical for daily use, but hybrid makes me feel better.... So it, apparently, hits a bit of a market niche in my brain.
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The hybrid system is only one part of a really interesting drivetrain - apparently the new setup maintains stoichiometric fuel-air ratios across the whole power band. Most engines will do power enrichment at higher RPMs, which is running very rich, with less complete combustion and exhausting a certain amount of unburnt fuel, with the effect of lowering temps and boosting top-end power power. Porsche is maintaining a stoichiometric burn, which reduces power, so they punched out the displacement and upped the turbo boost to maintain basically similar power while dramatically improving tailpipe emissions.
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The Porsche-supplied graphic in that article also says 1.9 kWh, so that's gotta be it.
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As with the Porsche system, though, the iForce Max hybrid system in the Tacoma (and 4Runner and Land Cruiser and so on) is really optimized more for performance than for fuel economy. It does help with economy, but it's largely a performance boost without penalty, rather than a strong hybrid system like you'd find in a Prius, Rav4, etc.
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If you have any chance of being alive in 75 years I doubt you pass the Ars ToC to even post.
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And it's apparently the size of a regular 12V car battery, which is pretty wild.
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Lots of rich people who care about the environment, but not quite as much as they care about looking cool or driving fun sports cars. This will allow them to scratch both itches simultaneously.
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That said I've seen some 1960s era 911 full electric conversions that look incredible. I'd love to try one out..
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IMO, circumstances now almost demand they continue the ND until they are done with ICE Miatas.
Mazda pretty much needed a partner (Fiat) to help make a business case for the ND. The business case for Miata is very tenuous to start with, so it pretty much NEEDs a long cycle life. There isn't a long cycle life ahead of a new ICE Miata built in the next couple of years.
It makes perfect sense for them to drag out the current model up until they are ready switch to an all new BEV platform.
Also the 2024 refresh (mostly in the electronics) was about meeting EU regulations, that actually forced many cars off the market in the EU this year (Including ICE Porsche Macan). There was significant expense in doing that. If they didn't plan on many more years, they should have let the car go off the EU market, rather than spend that.
Plus in a Japanese interview Mazda stated they will be trying to extend the ND out to about 2030:
https://response.jp/article/2024/02/13/379334.html (untranslated link)
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Maybe I missed it but what's the reason to increase the capacity by 20% for "a fraction" more power compared to the old engine? It also has the additional 11kW motor/generator helping provide more boost.
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