Combined Scandinavian League.

The five Nordic/Scandinavian countries of Norway, Sweden, Denmark, Finland, and Iceland have nearly 30 million people in them, and they are growing in population, Scandinavia has had higher birthrates over the past 30 years than most parts of Europe, from the Scandinavians themselves, not to mention their immigrants from Poland, Turkey and so forth, so the Scandinavian countries combined have a fairly large, fairly youthful population.
They are also fairly wealthy countries with strong economies, and combined the Scandinavian countries would have one of the larger economies in West Europe.
The people in the various Scandinavian countries are in many ways ethnically identical, they look the same, and Norway, Sweden, and Denmark have similar languages, and of course the people in all five of those countries speak English these days as well.
At various times in their history the Scandinavians have even been in the same country together, they have many similarities, they are more or less the same ethnic group.

I know that here in North America, people of Scandinavian background are all considered the same ethnic group.
Where I am in Minnesota in the upper midwest of the U.S., there is a large Scandinavian population, and along with the German-Americans, us Scandinavian-Americans are the largest ethnic group in the upper midwest states of Minnesota, Wisconsin, Iowa, North Dakota, and South Dakota, and we consider ourselves part of the same ethnic group, whether we are Norwegian, Swedish, Danish, Finnish, or Icelandic. We are Scandinavians.

None of the Scandinavian countries by themselves are large enough or have a large enough economy to have a truly top flight soccer league. But combine the five countries and Scandinavia could have one of the best leagues in Europe. A combined Scandinavia would have a population twice the size of Holland, and almost the size of Spain.

If teams in this combined Scandinavian league were located in all of the major cities throughout Scandinavia, in metro areas like Oslo, Bergen, Stavanger, Trondheim, Stockholm, Gothenberg, Malmo, Hesingborg, Copenhagen, Helsinki, and so forth, there would be a much larger population base, and there would undoubtly be more big money people from Scandinavia and elsewhere willing to purchase Scandinavian teams and put money into them, and eventually the quality of play would get better.
The combined Scandinavian league would stimulate much interest, undoubtly get bigger tv contracts domestically and internationally, and the increased interest would mean more team merchandise sold, and so forth.
And as the teams got bigger and better, larger stadiums could be built which would increase revenue and eventually more Scandinavian teams would go further in the European Champions League and the Europa League, with a better chance of winning those leagues, and making more money from that.

Imagine if the Spain was divided into five countries instead of one country as it is these days. Would the Spanish league be as good as it is? Of course not. The same with Germany, Italy, England, Holland.

In many ways, Scandinavia is like one country, one people, one ethnic group. The differences between Norway, Sweden, Demark, Finland, and Iceland is not that great. There is no doubt that a combined Scandinavian league would have better teams.

The combined Scandinavian league could be set up like Germany. There could be two top divisions with 16 or 18 teams in each division.
The teams that would invited into the Scandinavian first division would be the best teams from the largest markets to assure a sizeable population base for the league.
Teams like Oslo Vallerenga, Bergen Brann, Trondheim Rosenborg, Stavanger Viking in Norway, AIK Stockholm, Dungarden, Gothenburg. Malmo, Hellsingborg in Sweden, and the major teams in Denmark, and Finland, and so forth would form the combined Scandinavian league.
After the two top divisions, it would be regional leagues in each country, but the top two divisions would be throughout Scandinavia in a combined league.

You can be sure that a combined Scandinavian league would attract more attention, both in Scandinavia and internationally, and that the combined Scandinavian league would eventually became one of the top leagues in Europe, with more in attendance at the games, better players, from both Scandinavia as well as from other countries, more merchandise sold, and so forth.

If Scandinavian teams are ever to do better in Europe, they will need to have a combined league. It can be done, and UEFA would go along with it, just as they go along with Welsh teams in the English premier league. If the Sandinavians themselves consider themselves essentially one people with one league, UEFA would have to accept it, I don't know why they wouldn't. It would be incredible to have a combined Scandinavian league.
What do you folks in Scandinavia believe about this? I know some in Scandinavia have considered this combined Scandinavian soccer league.

 

In the U.S., it is different. We refer to ourselves as Scandinavian-Americans, whether we are of Norwegian, Swedish, Danish, Finnish, or Icelandic ethnicity.

The differences between the Scandinavians countries aren't that great, not enough to matter.
And you could still keep your national rivalries between the clubs in Norway, like the rivalries between Trondheim Rosenborg, Bergen Brann, Oslo Valerenga and so forth.
And Sweden could also keep their rivalries, and Denmark could keep theirs and so forth, because the Norwegian teams would still play each other as well as playing teams from the other Scandinavian countries.

The fact is this; if the Scandinavians don't combine in a Scandinavian league with the big Norwegian, Swedish, Danish, and Finnish teams together in one league, the Scandinavian teams will never have much of a chance of winning any trophy in Europe.
There are a number of small countries in Europe that never win trophies in Europe.

But a combined Scandinavian league would have a much larger population and a much larger economic base, and eventually the teams would spend more money and keep the better Scandinavian players and have the money to get better players from other countries, and the Scandinavian teams would have bigger gates at the stadiums, bigger tv contracts both domestically and internationally, would sell more merchandise and so forth, and then Scandinavian teams could win European trophies in the Champions League and the Europa League.

I would be willing to bet that once the people in the various Scandinavian countries got used to a combined Scandinavian league, they would like it better, with more exciting games, better players, and of course the Scandinavian teams would do better in Europe. Of course the Scandinavians would like that. Who wouldn't.

It may or may not happen, a combined Scandinavian league, but the play would be better, people would like it, and the Scandinavian teams would do better in Europe.

It would also attract more attention with the sizeable Scandinavian population in North America, and would attract interest from other people also, which could result in a bigger tv contract in North America, as well as a bigger tv contract in Scandinavia and Europe. It should be considered by those that want an improvement in Scandinavian soccer. It would be popular undoubtly.

 

I agree completely about a combined Scandinavian ice hockey league, that would be fantastic!
Ice hockey, along with soccer, is my favorite sport, and the favorite sport of many of us in Minnesota and the upper midwest states in the U.S., especially Scandinavian-Americans and Scandinavian- Canadians would like a combined Scandinavian league, even though we are fans of our own NHL league here in North America.

Many NHL ice hockey players are from Minnesota as well as Canada, and some of those NHL players are Scandinavian-North Americans, as well as players from Scandinavia and other parts of Europe.

As far as Finland goes, true it is a little different in language than Norway, Sweden, and Denmark, but the Finns are Nordics, and sometimes included with the Scandinavians and considered Scandinavian ethnics here in America.They look like Scandinavians and have a similar culture.

As the Norwegian and Swedish soccer leagues improve, they would be as good as Denmark, and there isn't that much difference anyway, in fact the best team in soccer in Scandinavia over the past 20 years has been a team from Norway, Trondheim Rosenborg.
The Rosenborg team has defeated AC Milan, Dortmund, and Valencia in the Champions league.
Only Copenhagen in Denmark has been anywhere close to as good as Rosenborg.
Sweden over the years has had some strong soccer teams as well, Gothenberg at one time was one of the strongest in Europe, and made a European final one year.

As far as the season schedule goes, that would have to be negogiated, but if the Scandinavian league was strong enough, with the potential for more money and increased prestige and better results in Europe, I believe Denmark would join Norway and Sweden, and possibly Finland, and they would work out a schedule.
If Iceland was to join they would only have one team, probably in Rekavik. Iceland actually should be included with Norway, since most Icelanders are ethnic Norwegians, from Norwegian Vikings originally.

There is no doubt though that a combined Scandinavian league would become one of the better teams in Europe. I hope it happens.

 

I agree. No one took that league seriously, it was played in the off-season.
A proper Scandinavian league played during the regular season with more teams would be something different and better than the so-called "Royal league".

 

Us Scandinavian-Americans and Scandinavian-Canadians over here in North America love both soccer and ice hockey. While it is true that Norway and Denmark are more soccer countries, and Sweden and Finland are known more for ice hockey, there are a large number of soccer fans in all of those countries, as well as ice hockey fans in all of those countries, and I believe that the Swedes would adjust to a combined Scandinavian soccer league, (as well as a combined ice hockey league), and would actually like it better once they got used to it.
You must remember too, that the traditional rivalries within each country would still exist in a combined Scandinavian league, the top Swedish teams like AIK and Malmo would still play each other, along with the other top Scandinavian teams in the other Scandinavian countries, the ultras, and the other fans, in Sweden and elsewhere in Scandinavia would still have their traditional rivalries.

Imagine how much better all of the top Scandinavian teams would be in a combined Scandinavian league, with a larger combined population, the extra money that the top Scandinavian clubs would have from wealthier investors, ads, stadium money, bigger tv contracts in Scandinavia and internationally, it would be such an improved quality of soccer, the salaries would be better, the best Scandinavian players from Norway, Sweden, Denmark, Finland, and Iceland would no longer have to go to England, Germany, Spain, Holland or Italy to make the big money, and the Scandinavian teams would be able to sign better foreign players as well as the best Scandinavian players.
Teams like Oslo Valerenga, Bergen Brann, Trondheim Rosenborg, AIK Stockholm, Goteborg, Malmo, Copenhagen, Brondy, Alborg, Helsinki, would develp quality teams who could compete with the top clubs of England, Germany, Italy, Spain, Holland, Portugal, France, and the combined Scandinavian league would have better teams than most of the European countries and equal to the best countries in Europe.

People must remember that at one time Norway, Sweden, and Denmark were one country, not that long ago, as recently as 1905 Norway and Sweden were still together. The Scandinavian countries are essentially the same culture, the same ethnicity.

At one time in the 1880s, Italy and Germany were subdivided into many countries, and those countries had no power, no clout.
The Italians used to say that north Italy was different from south Italy, that they were not exactly the same culture, that would never unite, but they did unite, they are all Italians and today Milan from north Italy plays Napoli from south Italy, and with the combined population of north Italy and south Italy, they have a strong league.
The same with Germany, at one time they were divided into a number of small countries.
Then in 1871 Bismarck united Germany. The Germans use to say that Prussia in north Germany was different culturally than Bavaria in south Germany, that they wouldn't unite, but they did unite, and a Prussian team Dortmund plays a south German Bavarian team Bayern Munich in the European Champions League final.

A united Germany, like a united Italy, has a strong league.

Imagine a combined Scandinavian league with teams from Norway, Sweden, Denmark, Finland, and Iceland, with a combined population of nearly 30 million, a major European league with that many people.
Some people in Scandinavia say that the various Scandinavian countries are too much different to unite, but are they? They are all nordics, they look essentially the same, they are essentially the same ethnic group, the same culture in many ways, people all over the world regard them as fellow Nordics, fellow Scandinavians.
And Norway, Sweden, Denmark have many cultural similarities in many ways, they speak essentially the same language ( and people in all five nordic countries speak English well these days anyway).

Each country in Scandinavia would still keep their own teams and traditions, just as north Italy has their own traditions different from south Italy, or North Germany has their own traditions seperate from Bavaria in south Germany.
But the Italians and Germans knew that united they were stronger.
Scandinavia should do the same. Or at the very least have unified sports leagues in sports such as soccer and ice hockey.
Scandinavia should be a major player in Europe, in many ways, politically, economically,and in sports. Why be relegated to the sidelines when you can be a fairly major player, and have some great soccer teams and great ice hockey teams. It is defeatist to say it can't be done. Of course it can be done, and it should. It would be fantastic.

 

Actually, the U.S. has joined with Canada in a shared league, the American and Canadian teams do play together in the same league.
And America, because of the many Mexican-Americans who live in the southwest U.S., also has close ties with Mexico. North America is developing as a region, with U.S., Canada, and Mexico.

I believe the Scandinavian combined league will eventually happen, they could make it work economically, and in the long haul it would make alot more money for all of the countries involved, for all the reasons I stated in previous posts. And it would be better soccer, a better quality of league..

 

The immigrants won't "take over" Scandinavia, they will be assimilated, they are already becoming assimilated, they are learning the Scandinavian languages, customs, and cultures, and one-third of East European immigrants and one of five Arab immigrants in west Europe, including in Scandinavia have intermarried with the west Europeans in the past 25 years.
And Scandinavia is still mostly Scandinavian.
Also the birthrates have been dropping amongst the immigrants in west Europe as they become westernized. They won't "take over" Scandinavia. The Scandinavians are not dumb enough to let that happen.
And in recent years there has been a reduction across Europe in immigration, that will continue.
The Scandinavian countries have high enough birthrates amongst the Scandinavians themselves that they don't need huge amounts of immigrants.

The effort to increase Scandinavian unity, politically, economically, and in sports is growing. The Scandinavians know that divided into five countries they are only small, insignificant northern "banana republics", with no power, no clout, and mediocre sports leagues.
United Scandinavian countries, as the Scandinavians once were, would make the Scandinavians actually players on the European and world scene.
Older conservative people in Scandinavia will resist change, as they usually do, but there is a growing group of young adults and educated people in Scandinavia who want more Scandinavian unity.

This is an article written in 2009 by the Swedish economist and historian Gunnar Wetterberg in a Swedish publication. The Nordic Council and the growing Scandinavian unity movement will lead the way.
Economy

Scandinavia: Putting our eggs in the Nordic basket

2 November 2009
Dagens Nyheter Stockholm

Image: Presseurop, Enterprise Group
Presseurop, Enterprise Group
Timed to coincide with the main session of the Nordic Council, Swedish historian Gunnar Wetterberg's proposal to unite the five states of northern Europe under one symbolic monarch, was launched by Stockholm daily Dagens Nyheter on October 27. Although it has failed to achieve unanimous support, it has caused a stir in the national press.
Gunnar Wetterberg
There is no doubt that a Nordic Union would have brilliant prospects – but it has to happen first. The five Nordic countries – Denmark, Finland, Iceland, Norway, and Sweden – have a total population of more than 25 million. In 2006, their combined GDP was more than 1,200 billion dollars (or 800 billion euros), making the Nordic region the tenth ranked economy in the world, just behind Canada and Spain but well ahead of Brazil and Russia.
The worldwide economic recession has highlighted the need for reinforced political co-operation and monitoring in Scandinavia, and the importance of participation in high-level decision making bodies, where our individual countries could not hope to achieve a level of influence that could be exerted by the region.
All of the Nordic economies could benefit from greater integration with neighbouring countries. As it stands, they are often overly dependent on one or two market sectors. When the Soviet Union collapsed, Finland found itself in difficulty.
Today, it is Sweden and its car industry which is under pressure. If every country continues to cope on its own, similar problems will inevitably arise in the future.
Finland continues to rely heavily on Nokia and the forestry industry, while Norway has an equally fragile industrial base.
A Nordic Union would provide the stability of larger more diverse economy and offer the region's young people a wider range of career development possibilities.
The Nordic Union could mount a more energetic defence of northern countries' values and interests. And such a Scandinavian union would also encourage the region's politicians to make a greater commitment to the EU, and improve their chances of obtaining key posts in the Commission and in the European Parliament.

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West Oslo is wonderful, mostly Norwegians and other west Europeans.
East Oslo is bad, that is where most of the immigrants in Norway live.
Yes they do have one of the worst crime and poverty problems in west Europe, there in east Oslo.

Norway as a whole is in good shape and not too many immigrants or too much crime.
Bergen, Stavanger, Trondheim, all lovely cities, as is most of the beautiful country of Norway.
East Oslo is the worst problem in Norway.
I get my demographic info from a number of sources.

 

The foreign student population of Trondheim is alot different than the immigrant population in east Oslo.
The students are better behaved, and of course many of them will leave and go back to their home countries after they graduate.

 

You are welcome.
I am always glad to educate my cousins, friends, and allies over in Scandinavia.