Devin Townsend: The Issue I Have With Frank Zappa

Some call him the modern Zappa, yet Devy's not really into Frank that much...

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UG News editor since early 2013. King Crimson fan. I handle the news around here.

Posted 10 hours ago

Devin Townsend: The Issue I Have With Frank Zappa

Despite being called the modern-day Frank Zappa by a portion of music fans, Devin Townsend said he's actually not into Frank that much.

The musician said on Talk Is Jericho: "I liked [Zappa], but I always felt he was... This is actually a hard thing to put across because Zappa fans are really serious...

"I would never in a million years deny his brilliance - a thousand more than I'll ever be. I just felt like he used his intellect in a sense that sounded condescending to me. It was more like, *snobby voice* 'I'm really smart and I've got a bunch of smart people playing with a xylophone here and you're really dumb.'"

Devy continued: "But you know who I did love? Captain Beefheart. Because it was a very similar kind of creative trip, but he was oblivious to the fact that he was out of his mind.

"And I loved that, because Captain Beefheart was like, *crazy voice* 'I'm gonna write a pop record' and it's like *mimics crazy trumpet sounds* woodoopdodoopdoopdoodoodoodooo, and people were like, 'Sure dude...'

"I liked that."

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Frank was condescending because everyone was condescending towards him. People treated him like some dirty, drugged-out hippie. "Serious" musicians dismissed him despite him being able to write circles around them. Nearly every major media interview conducted with him was done with a mocking tone. Record companies screwed with his art and his royalties. Police hassled him because of how he looked. He was attacked by numerous special interest groups who didn't understand the material they were attacking him for. I'd be pretty damn condescending, too.

Never knew that. I really need to check him out sometime.

Check him out! Outrageously prolific. Hot Rats is one of my favorite albums

Seems Devon is saying that FZ could seem condescending in a music compositional context, but I don't see that as a problem. If you want to write xylophone runs in 15 over 8 then why not? Or as FZ once said, "Hey, it's the 20th century, whatever you want to do to have a good time get on with it so long as it doesn't cause a murder". As far as FZ being condescending in other ways like lyrics, his main targets were mindless hippies, televangelist thieves, and crooked politicians so good for him. I really wish he had lived to see the events of the 21st century, I'm certain his commentary on 9/11, Dubya, Obama, and Trump would have been very amusing. My fave FZ political lyric was true when he wrote it and will probably always be the case: "If you think you got a raw deal and your back's against the wall... well let me tell you people you got no kind of deal at all... 'Cause what they do down in Washington... They just look out for number one... And number one ain't you... You ain't even number two" I love Beefheart too and agree with others that while FZ was very calculating and intellectual about his music and image, Beefheart was just batshit crazy! We're lucky to have had them both!

^what song is that quote?

Huge Zappa fan, but I don't disagree with Dev. Frank was kind of a dick. A brilliant dick.

A lot of brilliant people are, or were. For example, Noel Gallagher, who I love. Both personality-wise, because I don't mind his dick-ish nature, and musically.

I agree that Zappa was condescending to people who deserved to be looked down upon.

While that is true to some extent, nobody was saying and doing what Frank was. He was one of the first big names to tell the music industry to screw off and do everything himself. He was a little condescending maybe because he had to be. He is my favorite artist, but I didn't always agree with what he had to say. Devin did a good job though, to separate the man from the art.

Good thing noone will remember anything "heavy devy" did in 50 years, but Zappa is forever.

"This is actually a hard thing to put across because Zappa fans are really serious... " Looks like he was right.

Zappa comes off as one of those people who would tell any religious person they came across that God didn't real and would announce they were voting for Donald Trump "ironically"

"God didn't real" aaaand there goes the legitimacy of your comment

Educate yourself, "god doesn't real" has been a meme for years

Is it really educating yourself when you end up dumber for it?

Is knowing more memes really educating yourself, that is the question.

You're telling me this isn't the work of someone who has read and dissected the collective works of the great philosophers?

The fact that you educate yourself with memes says more about you than anything else possibly could.

That's right, shit on people for believing in God and voting for Trump. That'll show 'em.

It never ceases to amaze me that the anti-religion crowd always acts so childish. Hey buddy! Believe what you want! It is your life. Just don't make us live it, too! No point trying to push your view because while you think religion is fake, religious people think the same of your view of existence. Who is right? Who gives a care? You be you,I will be me, and that guy over their can be himself. It is not like my belief hurts you so just accept it as my opinion. Why can't people understand that?

Without listening to Frank Zappa, I thought he was the high priest of rock snobs. Then I listened to "Hot Fuzz" and realized that he had every right to criticize everyone.... I thought Devin Townsend was over-rated. Then I listened to "City" especially "Oh My Fu****g God" and thought Thank God.....

Hey Darlin', can I buy you a couple of drinks?

Nailed it

Zappa was a truly amazing musician, but he was not a very nice guy.

Beefheart was batshit crazy And he was actually in some respects an even bigger asshole than Zappa. Take the 1975 tour they did together (exemplified on Bongo Fury), Frank actually got so sick of Vliet's shit (which was mostly things like refusing to stay in the same hotel as the rest of the band, and otherwise being a disagreeable knob IIRC)that he didn't speak to him until he was dying. And the reason they were touring was to try and bail Vliet out of bankruptcy a little. Not only this but Vliet was accused of torturing and subduing his early band members so they were loyal to him (which honestly I don't believe, but people say it), annoyed his first and second guitarists so much they quit (Doug Moon apparently pointed a loaded crossbow at Vliet and Ry Cooder quit during a warm up performance at a festival scheduled just before Monterey where the Magic Band was scheduled to play).

Like others have said Zappa could seem like a douche because that's mostly how he was treated. Aside from his fans he was treated like a dog. People think he's crazy, but what they don't understand is that he just had his own way of expressing his art. And if someone is going to be disrespectful and ignorant to the fact that he was an amazing musician then screw them, and that was his attitude.

Maybe tonally, however, Watch out where the huskies go, and don't you eat that yellow snow.

Zappa was always a bit of a tool, but I feel like Devin is projecting that onto Zappa's music. Just because he wrote some complex stuff doesn't mean he was doing it to tell other people he was better than them.

I definitely get what he's saying. I also prefer Captain Beefheart for similar reasons. Massively talented, but seemingly completely batshit,and not being smug or academic about it.

Devin may be right, but I feel like that was part of Zappa's whole message. It WAS condescending, but it was (often) a commentary on the "American dream" mentality. Vliet > Zappa any day though

Fz and Devin are not alike at all, its a stupid comparison! Devin doesn't even like guitar solos and frank had albums that were nothing but guitar solos. they're both weird and prolific but that's where their similarities end. I love FZ and have tried to get into devin but i like guitar solos and not a fan of epic symphonic metal but i did like his ghost album a lot, its great on mushrooms

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