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Sony a6300 videos show off tech that may challenge last remaining DSLR strongholds

Published Feb 3, 2016 | Rishi Sanyal

Sony has just announced the APS-C a6300, an update to the immensely popular a6000. Its technological advances seem poised to break down some of the last remaining strongholds of DSLRs. Sony has released videos demonstrating some of these features on the a6300, including one showing 8 fps live view bursts with AF tracking, a comparison of this mode vs. a DSLR, and another video demonstrating AF with subject tracking in 4K video.

Shooting fast action bursts with a DSLR-esque live feed

The a6300 potentially addresses one of the largest shortcomings of mirrorless cameras for action shooting: the often stop-motion playback of last-shot images, as opposed to a live feed, when shooting continuous bursts.* We recently reported on Nikon's calling out of this particular weak point of mirrorless cameras, so Sony's response in the a6300 today seems timely. Essentially, the a6300 offers a live feed in the EVF or on the LCD during 8 fps continuous shooting, in between short blackouts, with continuous AF. This should make it much easier to both pan the camera and still keep your subject in the frame, or keep your selected AF point(s) over your subject. Have a look at 1:00 in the video below.

Live feed with no blackout at all (a la Nikon 1) is arguably the holy grail for mirrorless, and though Sony hasn't quite gotten there yet, it's taken a giant step toward making action shooting as practical on mirrorless as on DSLR. Furthermore, as Heading of Digital Imaging Neal Manowitz correctly points out in the video clip below, these advances also mean that the advantages of EVF, like immediate exposure preview, can now be combined with the immediacy of an optical viewfinder during action shooting. Especially with the newly updated 120 fps EVF.

Ultimately, how well this live feed works for fast action shooting - especially compared to DSLRs - will be largely dependent on the length of those blackouts between shots. Our initial impressions are very positive though: the blackouts appear very short in duration as we shoot these boxers in action in our hands-on video here. Sony claims that the length of blackouts is competitive when compared to a $1000-class DSLR, and demonstrates this effectively in the direct a6300 vs DSLR shootout at 10:04 in the video below (courtesy of Dave Etchells):

While a comparison against a $1000 DSLR might seem like a relatively low bar, the fact that Sony is getting a live feed off the sensor at all in between shots at 8 fps represents significant progress in the realm of mirrorless cameras. In comparison, a DSLR doesn't have to do anything but return the mirror to get you this 'live feed' through the optical viewfinder between shots. This is one reason many action photographers have stuck with DSLRs: the live feed in between shots helps a photographer follow moving subjects to either keep them in the frame or to keep the selected AF point over the subject. The technology in the a6300 seems poised to remove DSLR's stronghold in this regard.

Autofocus subject tracking

The a6300 also appears to have impressive AF subject tracking accuracy, following not just the dog but the dog's face in the demo video above. We'll reserve judgement until we get our hands on one, but previous Sony cameras had a tendency to wander off to other areas of the subject when using general subject tracking, so the results presented in this video indeed appear impressive in comparison. The expansive 425-point array also mean the camera can track the subject to almost any point in the frame, and all of these points purportedly work with A-mount lenses mounted via a LA-EA3 adapter (we expect Canon mount lenses to work as well, with appropriate adapters).**

Autofocus in video

Sony has also released a video demonstrating impressive AF in 4K video recording with native mount lenses. There appears to be little hunting, with fast refocusing and even subject tracking available during movie recording. Have a look below.

This should be a boon for videographers, assuming Sony now allows one to easily specify the subject before tracking it. On the note of specifying a subject, it's a huge shame that a touchscreen isn't paired with this capable video AF system for focus point selection.

At least on paper, we think that these advances mark some significant progress for mirrorless (it's too bad we can't say the same for the a6300's ergonomics), and we'll be curious to see how the systems perform when we get our hands on a production a6300.

* To be fair, this isn't the first mirrorless to provide a live feed in between shots in bursts: for example the Nikon 1 provides a live feed with no blackouts at all. It's just the first larger-sensor camera to do so at such high frame rates, and with - it appears - very short blackouts.

** It remains to be seen if subject tracking is available in any mode save for 'Wide' with 3rd party lenses though: subject tracking has been severely limited with 3rd party glass on the a7 II and a7R II due to the inability of the photographer to specify the subject, since it's only available in Wide area mode.

Tags: sony, sony-february-2016, technology

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Comments

Total comments: 328

it seems an interesting camera to me, even if I am an happy eos 6d user.
but i am curious to se how does it holds with canon lenses and the metabone adapter.
I wonder that because it doesn't have any stabilisation in camera and the brand new lenses launched by sony do not have any stabilisation.
personally I shoot a lot hand-held, so even if are beautiful lenses, are not very much useful to me.
I am look for the a review with someone using it handheld ;)

0 upvotes

QUESTION... how many of us portrait, wildlife, fashion and scenic photographers take continuous photos of sports cars bearing down on us at a high rate of speed?... NO THANKS Sony... my lowlight shooting Nikon D750 (30+ year Nikon shooter and never changing) is doing just fine at -3EV... and my 500+ photographic awards over on ViewBug will be climbing to over 600 very soon... ;)

http://www.viewbug.com/member/garyabigt#/garyabigt/awards

Comment edited 2 times, last edit 5 minutes after posting

1 upvote

I think there is a certain segment of the population who thinks of their brand (eg, Nikon) and their type of camera (eg, the single lens reflex mirror camera) as a religion that they must adhere to. For the rest of us, cameras are just tools, and there's no reason why you have to stick to one particular type of tool, or from one particular brand.

As for your comment "how many...take continuous photos of sports cars bearing down on us at a high rate of speed"...obviously, it's merely a demonstration of what this particular camera is capable of. What it points to is that for most people shooting in much more modest situations, the camera will handle it just fine. Besides, how many people regularly shoot in -3 EV light?

5 upvotes

Exactly, ego stroked? -tick

0 upvotes

"and my 500+ photographic awards over on ViewBug will be climbing to over 600 very soon..."

No wonder, every photo features a half-naked chick. Sex sells better than art.

Comment edited 37 seconds after posting

4 upvotes

Are you a porn industry photographer?

0 upvotes

Aaaaah... NO... not porn industry photographer. I don't shoot gynocology pics... just the elegant and classy stuff... pull your mind out of the gutter.

0 upvotes

"...significant progress for mirrorless (it's too bad we can't say the same for the a6300's ergonomics)"

I'm glad to see dpreview can understand this. Sony is out of control with its idiotic design decisions. They're not thinking of usability and ergonomics. There's no reason not to have some more useful customization and controls. (Let's say it had just 2 more C buttons - why not. You don't have to use them if you don't like them). There's a whole empty canvas of area to add useful controls and experiment with innovation in UI, but instead we get nothing. This is ok for some $200 'stylish' models but is WAY out of place for serious cameras. They're complete and utter fools in that regard, I'm certain of it. The top model (a7 series) looks like some ridiculous apple toy.

Don't get me wrong I'm consdering the 6300 because I think it will surpass anything on the market in this range for video but the design is garbage.

Comment edited 2 times, last edit 4 minutes after posting

1 upvote

I agree with the spirit of your post. The biggest one for me is why no touchscreen? I am considering this as well as all-round when low weight is of essence which is often.

0 upvotes

you can assign c1 / c2 / AEL buttons plus you can customize the fn menu the way you like, customization is fine as it is, a touchscreen and the ability to record videos with the shutter button when in video mode would be welcomed.

1 upvote

Some of you are going to need to chill; because I do understand you are looking at this model as the best put together of real photographic and modern abilities so far. Perhaps at a less bad price than something else. Plus many have "invested" (really an expense) in the A6000, lenses and other expensive parts already.

My thing is - One of the least bad combinations (A6300) here in this body is still very incomplete for a good balanced (benefit) system. One of the major problems is the price and including likely fall from MSRP is still not a good value. What's going on is throwing upper models in your face and those cost many times more. This is meant to make you think this is a bargain. It's not.

1 upvote

Besides body price and where you have been programed to suggest I can't, "afford it" (but I can) is the lens costs, comparatively. Now the lens comparison is based on CURRENTLY available lens costs (other systems) and their better known lens qualities. What difference do these new Sony lenses make if you can better those quality's elsewhere and for less? Now if comparable Sony lenses cost LESS then were talking.

I want to acknowledge that Sony (I don't even like) is doing better with innovations, it would seem than so called competitors. I'm saying leading in the 'less bad' here is NOT ENOUGH. I'm not failing to see better is as better does. That is promotable.

Mainly, it's time for Canikon and PanOly to wake up. Just don't think that your patience has nothing to do with competition. Stop buying on first adopter bragging rights. No one cares. The "brush" is about picture (INCLUDING video) good qualities including speeds, enough portability, and ease of controls.

Comment edited 3 times, last edit 14 minutes after posting

0 upvotes

It also can't look like a BluRay DVD player.

Do your homework and more than specs; BEFORE you hit the BUY button. Get these things and their parts into your hand and make some pictures with them FIRST. Take an SD card with you.

Photography is more than pushing the little button. It's extremely (and surprisingly) very deep and covering NUMEROUS different disciplines. It's all about the light.

I am hoping Sony, getting credit for some better and faster innovation will bring faster and better innovation from others. Meaning better competition. However I am not sure we have real competition. That depends on you.

Comment edited 4 times, last edit 11 minutes after posting

1 upvote

"Some of you are going to need to chill"...says the guy who just wrote a 1000 word essay on why people need to chill out. Hahaha.

0 upvotes

Reading is hard. Isn't it? Especially when logic conflicts with your point of view. Thank you for the encouragement to keep telling the truth. On that I will never stop.

Pretext is wrong. Funny thing is... Those who cry for brevity are the cause and actually asking for complexity (of the why). This is their incongruence and how you know. ...can't have it both ways. Pretext hides facts. Looking deeper exposes the lie.

Otherwise buy it and discover these things after it cost you extra. It's your choice.

Because good is as good does and evil is as evil does. Whether you see it or not.

0 upvotes

Here's a summary. If you like to take portraits of people then the used prices of the Nikon 50mm f/1.8 (the AF-S one) is $150 street. The Sony used is $220 (less popular to find) and darker in the corners. A D3300 for the Nikon lens has been on sale for $319 (refurb) and with new small kit lens. The A6000 (tested everywhere) is not a better camera. How much is the A6000 refurb? The market says it's over $500. That's just one CONTEXTUAL example.

$319 + $150 = $469 Nikon (Yet do not be brand loyal. There's others.)

>$500 + >$219 = > $719 and you get less overall. A6300 starts worse.

0 upvotes

Just answer the question:

Sony is trying hard technically and I commend that. When Sony does get the upper hand (thinking positively) in combined benefits overall, as the A6300 is now reported to do partly then do you think Sony will raise prices or lower them?

0 upvotes

More info:

Sony's 35mm f/1.8 is +$345 used. Far more than Nikon's APS-C(DX) 35mm f/1.8 at $150 or less. For folks looking for a general "normal" focal length style; Sony is much worse on comparable lens and sensor. Sure there are pro and cons. The title goes to Nikon D3300 in this example.

D3300 too small? It's new and smaller size might be for you. Is the A6000 to small for you and yet still not pocket-able? Pocket-able has it's place; but the best is still limited photographically. I'm all for mirror-less; when it's better.

Also of note is the retail price of the A6000 was $800 and the A6300 is $1000 ($200 more). In the case of a 35mm (focal) system, $200 extra to go A6000/35mm +$200 extra = $400 to go A6300/35mm; estimated used price ($700) after the next revision. So an EXTRA +$400 for a worse set of pros and cons. No. Not for people that can add and care about the system benefits; that matter. Sony, your best isn't good enough.

Shouldn't Sony cost less for less?

Comment edited 3 times, last edit 9 minutes after posting

1 upvote

Okay, how about battery life? I get over 1000 shots with my dslr. Do you offer radio trigger for flash? Third party TTL flash from phottix etc? Ultra wide lens like the Canon 11mm zoom? How is your after sales service and spare parts? or is this part of BATA (Buy and throw away) product?

0 upvotes

"google" it and you will see there's TTL and wireless trigger from phottix and even from sony flashes too. Well, real strobist don't use TTL but manual flash.

1 upvote

I have 5 spare batteries for my a6000 which take up practically no room. I can shoot for 2 days with those.
Plenty of off brand flash options for the camera. Phottix bring out a dedicated flash trigger in April and I've been using the older phottix flash trigger with the Newer brand flash units with great results.

Funny how people like to find problems when the really don't exist!

2 upvotes

A6000 user here. The multiple battery solution is a total PITA. Sure they don't take up much weight but you need to maintain a charge on all of those batteries. You either have five chargers or sit there switching out batteries every 4 hours. Yeah that's not a problem. I'll take decent battery life any day over pricey, hard to maintain and a hassle to constantly switch out multiple batteries.

Comment edited 2 times, last edit 1 minute after posting

0 upvotes

@NeilJones

With tax those 5 spare batteries would cost me $508.50. That's a problem that does exist.

0 upvotes

"tech that may challenge last remaining DSLR strongholds" Please DPReview is there really that many photogs that have issue with the AF performance of their DSLR? I would bet that less than 1% of all photographers would claim to hate their current cameras AF Performance.

2 upvotes

DPR says exactly that, DSLR AF is better than mirrorless. That's why it's considered as stronghold. For now.

1 upvote

Anyone with Pentax should hate their autofocus ability, especially with tracking across the whole sensor etc.

0 upvotes

I am looking fwd to the Dxomark speed/ISO scores for this a6300.

I've only found out, just yesterday, that even the older a6000 has a fantastic Dxomark ISO score of 1350. That is pretty impressive for an APSC sensor (Fuji X100 has a 1000 score for example). To put it in better perspective - the 5D classic has a similar ISO score of 1368.

If the new a6300 scores a little bit higher, maybe somewhere in between the 5D classic(1368) and 5DII(1815), I would be very happy with this and wouldn't mind giving up my old FF camera for it.

2 upvotes

What? I have been hearing A6300 better then DSLR, but now only can challenge DSLR. Not bad, but need to test on wide open f2.8 on 400mm and focus lock on unpredicted moment.

0 upvotes

It's a game changer!

0 upvotes

How many photographers shoot a 400mm f/2.8? How many photographers have *ever* even used a 400mm f/2.8? The reality is that that is a small subset of the photographic population.

1 upvote

As I said before and there where many people having the opposite view (telling about camera is about heart and and Sony doesn't have it etc), Sony will take over the market from Canon and Nikon.

1 upvote

I remember people saying the saying dismissive things in the early days of the Canon EOS system: that a camera is about "heart" and Canon EOS cameras don't have it, while Nikon F cameras do. They dismissed Canon EOS cameras as being all about fancy technology, not about "heart". Now they are saying the same dismissive things about Sony.

4 upvotes

Sony will not take over the market. They change too much in too short a time, which is due to their speed of innovation, or rather they make the decision to discontinue previous solutions if that is not beneficial for their new products.

Both Canon and Nikon have a very stable ecosystem with slow evolution of their products. Photographers that have invested in lenses can rely on the longevity of that investment with new cameras.

DPR is all about the tech boys, but tech is not always what drives market size. Sure, Sony will take a significant part of the pie, but they have a long way to go in terms of reliability. Both in their roadmap of products and backwards compatibility and in servicing. I don't think there will be a dominant company left. The cut throat competition will probably leave us with a few roughly equivalent camera companies (Canon, Fuji, Sony, Nikon).

0 upvotes

@PhotoRotterdam - "Sony will not take over the market. They change too much in too short a time, which is due to their speed of innovation, or rather they make the decision to discontinue previous solutions if that is not beneficial for their new products."

Ironically, that's how Canon came to become such a dominant camera company. They completely dumped their Canon FD system, and started with a completely new Canon EOS system that had almost no backwards compatibility with their previous system, and they had an extremely fast speed of innovation that allowed them to catch up, and surpass other more established camera systems.

People have very short memories, or are completely un-aware of history.

2 upvotes

Well certainly Sony board has more information about the market than us, so there is no clear answer fora yes or no, BUT, the current trend shows that many like Sony's innovative and market disruptive ideas and great cameras. They are a bit expensive and that's probably why they still cannot expect to have a larger cut from the market.

0 upvotes

Another winner from sony. The price tells us that this is not a replacement for a6000 though hmmmm. the Nikon V4/5 better blow us away. bring it on nikon

2 upvotes

showing us AF performance on bright sunny day conditions with high contrast subjects where modest crop sensor lens aperture diameters offer deeper dof, tells us only the AF need never work hard ...

if the lighting conditions were less contrasty, less bright, sundown, indoor, at home, in arena, etc, wider apertures be required, where shallower dof is present, and PDAF is more pushed to task

or if longer tele lenses with yet tighter apertures, not all PDAF points at the edges may work under such lower lighting, but only those pdaf pts clustering in the center

Comment edited 5 minutes after posting

1 upvote

both being shortcoming of all AF systems (any past mfr models)
has the 6300 shown any AF improvements where it counts !? (not just on a bright sunny/sun up day)

of course, any system, like FF, offering shallower dof, has greater AF challenges (e.g. A7-series, FF dSLRs, etc) and cannot focus as fast as a deeper dof APSC system, or tiny aperture diameter smartphone cam lens sys (=near infinite dof = near focus-free = easily fastest-AF)

come on, now!

0 upvotes

and would you shoot that kind of condition in hand held? who does a sport in fast moving action with "lighting conditions were less contrasty, less bright, sundown, indoor, at home, in arena, etc, "

duh!

0 upvotes

Kids at home = moving subjects at close vicinity in bad light = everyday practice = one reason for me to switch from mirrorless to DSLR until on-sensor AF-C improves considerably!

2 upvotes

Sdaniella is back....and talking to herself again.

Nothing you rambled about makes any sense.

5 upvotes

I'd say that reflects more on your reading skills...
Her post made complete sense.

2 upvotes

Well, if it's anything like the a6000, the reason why the tests are done with relatively good lighting conditions is because when you move to really dim conditions, the camera switches over to contrast-detect, which is noticeably slower and tracks poorly, but is very accurate. Sony's PDAF system isn't something I trust for extreme low light work: the kit lens tends to front/back focus if I use it in low light. Once I switch over to my Sigma lenses which are CDAF only, they focus much more accurately, but the speed varies according to the lighting. In daylight it's only a bit slower, but in ISO 6400 situations, the AF delay is maybe like half a second.

1 upvote

Physics still at work. The PDAF sensels are small and for any given area relatively few. This in turn means that they can only capture relatively little light compared to a big PDAF module of a DSLR.

The workaround is to increase exposure of every single Live View frame, which in turn decreases fps of Live View, which then in turn decreases the speed of the AF feedback loop.

At one point PDAF sensor exposure is so low that the camera switches to CDAF, because it can then make use of more sensels (albeit not necessarily the whole sensor area, Olympus uses line skipping during Live View, Samsung's NX1 is said to not do, no idea about Sony cameras).

0 upvotes

Actually AF system has more difficulties when depth of field is wide, as it is far more difficult to find the strongest contrast point.

If the depth of field is narrow, it is way easier as the overshoot shows faster and more accurately when the focus is achieved.

But mirrorless cameras focuses wide open, not aperture closed down to the chosen F-stop like with DSLR.

So every frame in C-AF with burst mode requires the aperture is opened, focused, closed, photo taken, opened, focused, closed, photo taken.

Where DSLR is just like keeping aperture as chosen one and then keep focusing all the time. Until you hit f/8 limit.

0 upvotes

My Nikon D750 focuses wide-open using PDAF (viewfinder). When you force it to stop down (DoF preview) it refuses to focus even. Using CDAF (Live View) it focuses at the currently chosen f-stop.

On the other hand Olympus mirrorless cameras focus wide-open using either PDAF or CDAF. But you can force them to focus at a slower f-stop by using DoF preview (where the Nikon refuses to focus at all).

So it's not a thing or DSLR vs. mirrorless, but of specific camera implementations and exposure/low-light limits of focus-sensors.

Comment edited 2 minutes after posting

2 upvotes

You said: ***when you move to really dim conditions, the A6000 switches over to contrast-detect, which is noticeably slower and tracks poorly, but is very accurate.***

It's a little more complicated than that...the A6000 and likely the A6300 don't have a specific light level cutoff where PDAF turns off - what matters is whether there is sufficient light in any part of the frame to allow PDAF sensors to trigger and track - the overall scene might be one dark enough to require extremely high ISO, very low light conditions at night, but there could be just enough light on a pinpointed subject that the PDAF will remain active, and continue to focus. I've shot my A6000 at night at F4 200mm where in order to keep shutter speeds at 1/500 to 1/1000 to freeze action, I needed ISO12800 and was still slightly underexposed, yet the PDAF in AF-C mode continued to track moving subjects (the 'dancing dots' PDAF points still lit and followed the subject as it moved) and focus was accurate.

1 upvote

I rest my case.
sony's too ideal sunny conditions for AF-demos is unimpressive
show us everyday dimmer mom-n-dad scenarios shooting kids/toddlers scampering around at home or indoor gym/arena/dance class, etc

at least we know higher prosumer/pro dSLR model now handles PDAF beyond F8, beyond just center-pt, and hi-cont fps in liveview with NO blackouts on an LCD

Canon EOS 1DX MarkII :)
this is the first 1D-series for me to be seriously impressed, even though I tend to shy away from the larger (heavier) pro Canon dual-grip bodies
I hope the zero-blackout hi-cont fps in liveview trickles over to 5DIII/6D replacement ... perhaps 10fps full-res will be enough on a 5D4/6D2

such effective pdaf in lower light
now ...
established a couple of days ... before new Sony a6300 announcement

and leaves recent Sony's A7-RX-series & new Nikon's D5 releases redfaced short on what consumers REALLY want, genuine improvements minus big flaws.

Comment edited 2 times, last edit 6 minutes after posting

0 upvotes

you shoot kids with ambient light and machine gunning a big long lens and big body DSLR? I got good shots of my a6000 in ambient room light with cheap lens with 12fps continuous drive. For sports, gosh, dim light and sunset. Who does a sport with such lighting condition?

0 upvotes

I have shot stage performances, including dances using center point and recompose on my Sony a6000 using a manual focus lens. It's not about how high spec the camera is, but what you do with it. It's about snapping a decisive moment, not bursting shots every second and hoping you get lucky.

0 upvotes

Blah Blah Blah I will curb my enthusiasm until some real world testing is done.
Trust yet verify.
And BTW its still too small for serious shooting.
Pete

1 upvote

good luck lugging your gears then.

8 upvotes

What's gears got to do with photography? He's not building a machine.

1 upvote

what's gears got to do with photography? It's everything. Sounds like you don't have an idea bringing large DSLR equipments with big backpacks walking and lugging anywhere like airport and tight events.

0 upvotes

Lol but it has to be big to be professional, just like it has to be FF (everyone forgets MF)

Tools for the shot, that's what it's about, not size, sensor size, brand, colour etc.

0 upvotes

then if sizes and weights are big and heavy, good luck on your back pain and muscle aches.

0 upvotes

LOL learns the English mores pleases.

0 upvotes

Gear not "gears". Gears are for cars and machines.

0 upvotes

One of the main dSLR strongholds is not requiring battery power when composing a shot.

Which on a tripod - for me at least - can take 5 - 10 minutes between angles, off a tripod maybe even longer between shots - continually eyeing angles between - i.e requiring seeing through the viewfinder over that period.

EVF encourages rushing the process of taking shots, anyone who disagrees I believe is being disingenuous - or hasn't realised they are being quietly rushed.

To me the mirror - seeing the actual light freely available - not requiring battery power - is the real WOW - it was and always will be - it's the light from the actual subject.

1 upvote

I suppose you can turn off the camera for these long compositional pauses. But then you cannot focus unless using a manual lens. Otherwise the DSLR is burning thru the battery.

My Nex6 has a large battery that has not been an issue and I assume the new version is about the same. The battery lasts far longer than a 36 exp roll of film and is much easier to swap-out.

0 upvotes

...without turning the camera on all my Pentax lenses manually focus just fine without a battery - I just turn the mechanical focus ring

and then compose a shot for as long as I want, or refocus, without turning the camera on.

Camera batteries are rated in terms of photographs taken - which is only one part of the story, I can taken 800 photographs on a battery, but that's over 4 weeks of using a dSLR - a lot of looking through the viewfinder! - and not feeling rushed.

My EVF based GH4 lasts me 2 days with similar usage - worst of all I feel rushed - it really doesn't help.

The battery 'rating' in the GH4 is good, similar amount of shots to a dSLR but it needs recharging 12 times as often.

Give me the battery non-draining light of the sun through an OVF.

0 upvotes

XPro2?

0 upvotes

The battery issues are non-existent if you find an EVF to be the better tool. I carry more batteries than before --I find this a good tradeoff for a better shooting experience. YMMV.

4 upvotes

I get that "feel rushed" thing. the Nikon V1 with it's very large battery doesn't give me that feeling. Nikon let us down with the small battery in V2/V3.

0 upvotes

I the Sony Smile shutter implemented in th A6300?

0 upvotes

It is impressive where Sony has taken these engineering concepts, but then, I said the same thing when the Nikon 1 came out. I expected it would not be long before that tech moved to the Dx and Fx sized sensors, I was wrong, or perhaps, premature in my excitement. Just think about a FX sensor with IBIS, and DUAL IS in some cases trying to perform all the things we "desire". The processing power and battery power alone will be engineering wonders. It will be a time before these mythical Fx products appear, if ever, sadly.

1 upvote

No time like the present to get it on!

2 upvotes

I think it has got amazing specs... but then I was browsing some Ansel Adams et al pictures and I started to wonder what the hell I'm doing.

I mean, there's people ranting others as dinosaurs or as a clueless tech geek. But truth be told, and I know I'm stating the obvious, the most important part is the final picture.

To either people criticing each other... I just hope you're taking an amazing pictures, because I felt a little bit ashamed when I can't do what those even more old dinosaurs took in the past.

Of course I wont' dare to say that the tech innovation is useless. It's damn good. But just a thought that might calm you down when you rant each other over camera specs.

7 upvotes

Yon can now replicate what Ansel adams did with your phone.

1 upvote

true, but that was not the point...
And... can I?

Comment edited 1 minute after posting

2 upvotes

Ansel Adams was known for the large amounts of time he spent in the darkroom touching photos up. He was doing in the darkroom what most of us are now doing in photoshop.
People seem to think that Ansel Adam's pictures were pure and untouched but they were heavily modified. The endresult is still stunning by the way.

4 upvotes

Which adds more awesomeness to those dinosaurs :)

3 upvotes

Again a touch screen camera. The best property of touch screen is the fact that it can be turned OFF. When doing that, I believe this is a very good camera to use.

2 upvotes

what cameras have you had to use where the touch interface was so bad you had to turn it off?
i wish my DSLRs - and even my phone camera - had a sensible touchinterface like my Panasonic micro43's.

3 upvotes

Panasonic Lumix DMC-GM1.

2 upvotes

The a6300 doesn't have a touchscreen which is a deal breaker to me. I don't see what anyone could have against a touchscreen that makes things much faster and easier to use.

0 upvotes

interesting. especially with the simpler cams (had the GF5) the customized touchinterface adds much to a positive user experience - for me. especially compared to similar cameras having no touch.
but i have to admit it took me some time to see the usefulness.

0 upvotes

First of all, the A6300 doesn't have a touchscreen.

Secondly, there's nothing wrong with a touchscreen. A good touchscreen interface works great! We live in a smartphone and tablet world. Do you not have a smartphone with a touchscreen? Or do you turn OFF the touchscreen on your smartphone, LOL.

0 upvotes

Rishi - any word if the a6300 has UHS-II support? The slow write times with the A7rII is really frustrating at times, would be nice to see Sony start to implement this. I haven't seen it in the specs, and I'd assume it would be featured if that was the case.

1 upvote

The a7R II has UHS-II support. I think its slow write speeds have to do with something else?

Seeing as how the new a7R II and a7S II have UHS-II support (in fact require it for the higher spec videos), I'm pretty sure the a6300 does as well. But I don't think that guarantees fast write speeds for images.

I share your frustration. It's one of the worst things about the a7R II.

0 upvotes

That's surprising, because looking at how fast other UHS-II cameras write, the A7rII really lags far behind. Top spec cards are completely wasted on Sony's and its frustrating 4k's top spec requires high speed U3 cards, but write speeds top out at about 36 MB/s while others like the NX1 (58+) and the EM5II (80+) write much quicker.

Thanks for the reply.

0 upvotes

I'm sorry, I'm wrong. I don't think the a7R II has UHS-II support. While I do use UHS-II Speed Class 3 cards in the a7R II, I believe it's only using the UHS-I bus, and ignoring the 2nd set of pins.

That probably explains the slow write speeds. Not sure the a6300 has improved things, but we'll look into it.

Sorry for the confusion.

0 upvotes

No worries, like I said really annoying how slow it can be at times. I'm interested in the a6300, but would really like to see write times improved.

It just sucks that you have to use U3 cards for 100mb/s video, but the camera doesn't take advantage of the speed otherwise. The fast cards I use in the A7s to record 100mb/s video can't do top spec 4k in the RII, so I was forced to upgrade. Just makes no sense.

0 upvotes

The work of AF is not impressive although too many AF points...

1 upvote

subjective too subjective..

0 upvotes

compare with AF-C in Nikon

0 upvotes

Ok, by watching the video I know enough.
Using this camera is like playing a videogame from the mid- 80's.

Its totally true that Sony camerass feel like operating a computer instead of a camera.

17 upvotes

And you know that just because you watched a video, wow clever.

25 upvotes

Nope, because I used several Sony cameras and they all feel horrible. They are computers with a menu structure to them that feel like using Windows 3.1.

I think this new camera won't feel any different and they state it with the music behind the videos.

10 upvotes

I think that's a bit harsh. I use an a6000 and I definitely agree that the interface feels more like using a computer that can take photos than the kind of camera experience Fuji or Olympus offers. But once you've gone through the process of customizing your buttons and menus, the shooting experience becomes pretty pleasant, though yes, you'll still never shake off the feeling you're using a gadget than a dedicated camera.

3 upvotes

You sound like a grumpy old man.

I am a long time Canon DSLR user, and I also now use Sony mirrorless. As far as I can tell, they both operate like cameras and computer, because that's what they both are. If you really, really hate the notion of a camera being a computer, you should go back to using film. Digital isn't for you.

35 upvotes

Well he's a fujifilm guy....

3 upvotes

It's ok, Sony are designed for the younger generation who are more than happy operating computers. Fuji and Lecia still do stuff for the older guys who are a bit stuck in their ways.

4 upvotes

Same for most digital cameras. They all have a menu and control wheel driven way of operating them.

Personally I am happy with a shutter speed dial and a aperture click on the lens. Now THAT is a camera - all the others are computers in comparison.

I don't see your point. How is a Canon ( for example ) menu system any less of a "computer" than a Sony menu?

2 upvotes

lol

0 upvotes

*Yawn* people used to say the same when film SLRs got AF and digital status panels and features like eye AF. People said the same when the first cameras with colour LCDs came out. People said the same when mirrorless cameras came out.

The camera has a full manual mode just like the good old days, the technology isn't forced on you. You don't have to install windows to take a photo.

Typical backwards looking "in my day" attitude. If people like you were in charge there wouldn't be computers to tell the world about how much a camera is like a computer.

7 upvotes

"No need to know anything about composition"

You're just being silly now.

6 upvotes

I guess by your reckoning, that's why people buy flagship cameras like the 1DX and D4, because they are really terrible photographers in real life, and it's the camera doing the work for them.

1 upvote

@ Dheorl.
Young people use touchscreens.

0 upvotes

I'm a young person, I don't.

2 upvotes

Donnie Diafragmino,
that's a lot of psychological nudity and blaming the camera is not helping. Please stick to the setup that makes you happy. :-)

3 upvotes

@Dheorl
Come on, you don't have a smartphone nor a tablet ?

0 upvotes

I have a smartphone, but only because of the apps it has. If blackberry had an app store that was as full I'd buy one of those instead.

I also assumed this was a discussion about cameras... I've had touch screens on many of my cameras. They're the second thing I turn off, right after the annoying beeps.

1 upvote

Touch screens are a joke in cameras, nobody needs those.

2 upvotes

Pentax has by far the best ergonomics and I've had 3 Nikons, a Panasonic and have used a couple of Canons. I've never shot the Sony, but I've held a few at stores and they feel weird, like they were made to fit a midget woman's hands. I can't quite get a comfortable grip on them.

0 upvotes

Funny to hear that when all japanese manufacturers were considered just a technical copy and "souless" camera based on Leicas or any other "true" photographer's tool from Europe.

Comment edited 36 seconds after posting

3 upvotes

Whats all the hate for touch screens? I like them a lot.
Weird people here. Almost wearing an "anti-progress" position as a badge of honour.

Maybe its photo snobbery.

2 upvotes

Half the time when I'm taking photos I'm climbing mountains and would rather stick with big chunky knobs. Obviously this varies greatly for different people, but the only thing I think the touchscreen is sometimes useful for is focus point and even then I'd take a nice joystick on the back for accuracy.

0 upvotes

I remember when my first SLR had a lightmeter that actually read *through the lens* OMG! (Miranda GT 1968). No camera today operates even remotely like those old 35s and Rolleis, and Speed Graphics, lol...not at all...
I love touch-screens. Don't like it, turn it off :)

0 upvotes

I generally dislike touchscreen interfaces on cameras. The one on the Nikon D5500 is functional, but unnecessary. And I hate the way Olympus bodies use the touchscreen to omit physical buttons. With that being said however, Panasonic's touchscreen implementation is really good, and Canon's touchscreen experience on its Rebel and 70D cameras is simply outstanding. It's so well thought out and integrated into my muscle memory that using a 7DmkII that omitted the touch feature felt like a step backward.

1 upvote

the interface couldn't be worse than olympus, could it ?

0 upvotes

shut up! be thankful that has computer and microchips in it. Because this is digital age. Hellowww. What do you expect? hide the digital inside and put analog knobs and analog meters? duhhh.

Comment edited 25 seconds after posting

0 upvotes

OMG.. so impressive! I'm sold!
I'm going to dump my snappy DSLR and all my top lens right now..
<thinking...thinking>

Wait, no way!
I might wait for the A6<insert actual numbers> Mk<insert actual re-realease mark with bugfixes & minor upgrades> end of this year, the easily another "Camera of the Month" by Sony!
..with more 576 AF point and more 12fps burst, etc. which finally will make all DSLRs useless bricks.. LOL!

Fooled once, not again Sony, not again! :)
Sorry Sony, my wallet remains closed.

Come on, you can do better!
We all waiting for the A6666Rs+ MkIV to finally match up with DSLR's...

Comment edited 1 minute after posting

12 upvotes

Im impressed at such certainty from someone who has never tried the new camera and apparently rejects the idea that science and engineering can progress.

26 upvotes

Your DSLR won't be "useless", but it will still be a "brick", at least in size and weight. :)

I'm a long-time DSLR user myself. I know my DSLRs have not been rendered "useless" by mirrorless cameras such as the Sony A6300. However, I have chosen to use them less and less, because I've chosen to opt out of carrying around the brick weight my DSLR gear. Just my choice.

Comment edited 2 minutes after posting

6 upvotes

Can you shed some light on this? What is so awful about the sony system cameras? Every good photographer who tried it for MILC is seriously disappointed. Does it kill an offspring when you open the box?

2 upvotes

@Daft Punk: I had it already..
Im impressed at such certainty from someone who has missed the whole point of my post and apparently think that science and engineering is only progressing with the milc product lines.. LOL!

1 upvote

@T3: Exactly!
You have right, when you said some people tend to use them less and less, because they chosen to opt out of carrying around their brick weight DSLR gear. Well said!

But those who still carry, carries with a good reason.. :)
When they solve all the stupid problems of milc, maybe will be on pair with DSLRs.. but we are still far from there to be honest.

Just my experience, form one of the "last remaining stronghold" form the many, against human credulity & overhyped Sony marketing bs...

1 upvote

I see mirrorless as an alternative, not replacement for a DSLR. I have an injured right wrist, so even though I value having a full frame DSLR, I don't want to carry it around for everything. My Sony a5000 can do the job if the lighting isn't extremely dim and it's a much smaller, lighter and cheaper combination.

Comment edited 2 times, last edit 3 minutes after posting

0 upvotes

@kisvakoncl -"But those who still carry, carries with a good reason.. :)"

I see those reasons as being less and less with every passing year. Already, I don't use my DSLR gear much anymore.

"When they solve all the stupid problems of milc, maybe will be on pair with DSLRs.. but we are still far from there to be honest."

Still far from there? I've been conducting an experiment on myself, living with both DSLR and mirrorless gear for the past couple of years, just to see which gear I reached for the most. I overwhelming use my mirrorless gear the most often. My DSLR gear, not so much anymore. "Still far from there"? I think we're already there, or very close to there. In fact, one of the reasons I mainly use my MILCs is for the things that they can do that my DSLRs *can't* do (face detection AF, focus peaking, focus magnif, exposure preview, smaller size, etc). In many ways, DSLRs need to be able to "get there". That's been my experience.

1 upvote

@kiskgjnribm
that's a split personality post if I ever saw one.
Seriously, who did this to you?
You want it but you don't. Sony should do better so you would, except no way sony's going to fool you again?

0 upvotes

how about sensor reflection, as A6000 does badly...

5 upvotes

I've never seen "sensor reflection" in my A6000.

5 upvotes

Badly? What? Post an example. I have a6000 and this problem doesn't exists.

2 upvotes

i'll submit sample tonight,,,yes it's bad..same lens on A7ii, zero reflection, on A6000, horrible reflection...all glasses does similar reflection with strong lightbuls on corners.they're not lesn flare, same lens on A7ii does 0 .

1 upvote

damn.. panasonic gh4 take a look!!

1 upvote

50 lines per mm from a 36x24mm sensor is 1800x1200 = 2.16 MP. Did somebody miss a zero there? They saying 500 lines per MM? That's 216 MP.

18:40 time in the announcement video.

Comment edited 46 seconds after posting

0 upvotes

It's the resolving power of the new G lense, not the sensor.

0 upvotes

It's the frequency of lines used to generate MTF curves across the frame (or radially outward to be exact) for iteration of lens design if I understand correctly. It's correct, no missing zeros. Most others show MTF curves for 30 lines/mm when it comes to resolution (10 lines/mm for contrast).

1 upvote

so what sensor resolution does that equate to?

0 upvotes

50 lines is a specific MTF readout. It describes how high the contrast between the lines at this spatial frequency is, not resolution!

2 upvotes

Looks like it's all about the AF system according to the first video... looks very impressive. But that soundtrack wins a "Grazzy" award for a stratospheric annoyance quotient.

8 upvotes

What is impressive about the video. Huge depth of field, huge car coming straight towards camera, bright lighting. Could they have made it anymore easy.

2 upvotes

"Huge car coming straight to wards camera"
On watching the car video a second time I noticed that the AF points do not stay on the same part of the car, but jump several meters from front to the rear as it turned. I wonder what it would do if it had been 2 dirt bikes for example ? Jump from the right one to the "wrong" one alongside ? Certainly an easy task for the camera here.....

1 upvote

The cars do not seem to be driven very quickly , certainly no where near racing speeds, if they were at full throttle I would not get more than 3-4 still shots at 6fps an such a short distance travelled, regardless of camera being used. Bright day, short focal lengths camera on a tripod, not exactly a hard case for focusing ability.

1 upvote

impressive, wonder if there is any improvements in sensor sensitivity?

0 upvotes

Once again Sony takes two steps forward and one step back. The new EVF, improved AF, awesome video specs, Slog3 and so on are awesome - but then there's no headphone jack to monitor the great audio courtesy of the new (or old if you're a Nex user) mic input and all those wonderful AF points dancing across the frame but no way to quickly change subjects or focus point. This is especially annoying when shooting video and my favorite feature of a number of other cameras, just touch the screen to move focus. The new PADF should be really accurate and make racking focus a breeze.

Grrrr....

4 upvotes

> two steps forward and one step back

To be fair, what you describe is more like "two steps forward instead of three steps forward" -- and then only for those who really need that extra step.

For me personally, it's just two steps forward, period.

8 upvotes

Lack of sealing at this price, one control dial?? No touch screen with a video centric camera?? Two steps forward one back was being kind, I would say one forward two back, simply because the competition are all improving as well. To ask $1k for a non sealed camera with one control wheel is horrible, especially when one has to shell out a lot for the best E mount glass.

4 upvotes

haven't you heard manual controls are for hipsters

0 upvotes

Haa no I haven't, but then I'm only 17 so I have an excuse.

0 upvotes

@Brian, it does have partial weather sealing, just not completely weather and dust-proof. It also has two control dials, the main top dial, and the rear wheel. Just that the NEX-7 did one better by having two top dials so you can use the rear wheel for direct ISO control without needing to press a button first.

As for the lack of touchscreen, that's a legitimate complaint. But for video, the AF tracking capability is very good on the a6000 and a7 series that you're probably better off letting the camera do it. I tried it last weekend and it was able to track my subject perfectly even while I was moving. Still, you're right, and having a touchscreen would have made things better.

0 upvotes

Thermidor, if I was still chasing rally cars, or any other off road/dirt track motor sport as in the video , then I would certainly want something that is dust proof !

Comment edited 1 minute after posting

0 upvotes

@Mike, I found that odd that the advert shows them tracking a rally car yet it's not dust proof lol.

0 upvotes

There's no such animal as "Dustproof" --only varying degrees of dust resistance.
Oh, and don't change that lens...

1 upvote

But the spec sheet does claim the body IS weather sealed. Probably not to the level of a flagship DSLR, but it certainly ought to be able to handle a day at the beach or in the rain. Especially given that this is the first Sony mirrorless explicitly claimed to have weather sealing. The original marketing copy for the A7 claimed weather sealing, but it was quietly withdrawn after being proven false. The real question is what existing FE lenses are weather sealed? I don't remember seeing rubber gaskets on the Zeiss 24-70 f4.

Comment edited 39 seconds after posting

0 upvotes

nice. i am doing film lately. https://slate.adobe.com/cp/5Q3ON/
so did i missed another upgrade?

Comment edited 14 seconds after posting

3 upvotes

I checked your photos and they are superb. Great story, gorgeous pictures. Film unquestionably has a look and feel that cannot be emulated in digital. In the hands of a capable photographer it can be supreme. Beyond that, the vision of the photographer trumps all. Leave the gear to the gearheads!

I added you on Flickr.

Comment edited 1 minute after posting

1 upvote

Yeah amazing shots there Marcus! I shoot film in B&W, and was mostly using a Kodak Gold for colour, so it doesn't quite have that cool, yet contrasty look from your shots. I have a roll of Fuji as well, I should pop it in after finishing my current roll of Agfa!

Where did you take the photos at? Looks like Sg Buloh, but I'm just guessing.

Comment edited 5 minutes after posting

1 upvote

VSCO does a pretty good job with Fuji 400h in Lightroom. It is pretty slick to have 100s of film choices to apply to the raw information from the sensor. I don't think you're missing out on much though if you already have a good rig. The next Fuji x100 is what I'm interested in so I always have a good small camera with me everywhere. Find a camera you like and use it. When there are 50 megapixel sub 1000 cameras that have a great human interface then you would probably be missing out still on film.

0 upvotes

thanks for the compliments guys. @bernardly thanks for the add. @thermidor it is :-) try using those porta/fuji 400 h if ur want amazing skin tones.
@nick seal . hmm yeah i have that whole VSCO set, but frankly its super frustrating trying to get the film look. VSCO tries its best. In the end i decided to let digital be at its best (Clean, commerical, look) and film for life and portrait stuffs.

2 upvotes

This, for $1K? I might finally be able to get into wildlife photography. Oh wait, there are no FE "big gun" wildlife lenses... Drat. I wonder how well this AF system works with a Canon super-tele... If the A7R II's adapter EF-FE performance is any indicator, it won't be too shabby...

5 upvotes

You could probably use the 70-200 F2.8 GM with the 2x teleconverter. That gets you 600mm equivalent F5.6 - not too shabby. Not sure what the optical quality will be like with those TCs though.

8 upvotes

i suspect a 100-400 is around the corner. When they're ready for a full-on sports camera to challenge a 1DXii / D5, they'll make a 400/2.8. And then they'll only sell 5-year old sensors to Nikon. :P

0 upvotes

Good point, Rishi. Well, considering the Alpha 70-200 2.8 is $3K, I'm going to hope that this one is optically flawless, and that the 2X is decent enough to do a 100-400 f/4-5.6 proud...

0 upvotes

It works with the LA-EA3 like the A7R II, so A-mount glass will have OSPDAF capability.

0 upvotes

Still, it's no 400 2.8 or 600 f/4. Then again, it's 1.5x.

0 upvotes

Matthew, looking at your website and DPR gallery, you don't need long tele lenses or fast AF, so don't worry about it ;-) I use Canon super tele lenses on a Sony NEX and AF still doesn't interest me, but this camera does for other reasons.

You seem to be all worked up over something you don't need for some reason :-)

2 upvotes

I have an a6000 (and it's been great for family and baby and travel shots) but I gave up waiting on Sony to give me a native E-mount lens. I tried the LAEA4 with A-mount lenses and I didn't like it. Maybe this could work with the LAEA3 and A-mount super-tele lenses.

In the meantime, I'm happy with my refurb D7100 + Tamron 150-600 (but I want the Nikon 200-500!) for about what the A-mount 70-300 lens costs.

0 upvotes

@Nzmarco, I've had this discussion before with folks who tried to point out the same thing. My answer is, I simply haven't had my mid-life crisis yet, but when I do, I'll definitely NOT be "wasting" my money on a Harley or a Porsche, I'll be buying a big fat super-tele lens and going on an African safari. Just because I haven't photographed it yet, doesn't mean the dream isn't there. :-)

0 upvotes

Thomas Stirr uses V2/V3 for good reasons. Check out his blog

1 upvote

Good point zzzxtreme. He does beautiful things with the old V2 and that lovely CX 70-300 (800 mm FF equivalent!) lens.

0 upvotes

Looks impressive.

They had time to incorporate a touch screen, and they should have. Even if it's only function is touch to focus, that would be fine.

6 upvotes

You're right, with this many AF points, folks who are used to conventional AF point control are going to be frustrated unless there are a LOT of "point-skipping" options for moving their selected AF point. A touchscreen would have been amazing for AF point control, from what I hear from Rishi at DPR.

2 upvotes

I wonder how can people have a spare hand to hold the camera, another hand to press shutter button and a third hand to touch focus ?

6 upvotes

not holding the camera probably and touch screen will vibrate the camera and blurry every single of your shots and in worst case you will drop your camera one day by doing that

0 upvotes

There are plenty of ways to hold / mount a camera that leaves either your right or left hand free to touch the touchscreen. But, you do have a good point. I have yet to get much experience with touchscreen AF point control, and with a huge long lens that requires support, it might be impractical unless you're on a tripod or monopod.

1 upvote

yes , you need to mount it on a tripod to use touch AF, but in what situation people will set a tripod and touch AF? just doesn't make sense

0 upvotes

I own a Samsung NX500, the best thing to do with touch monitor is to input the wifi password. you can't even use touch to netvigate the menu, the screen just 3". think about it peoples, don't mess up iPhone with a camera which need both hand to hold with

0 upvotes

It works great on other cameras benny, you are overthinking it.

7 upvotes

I don't have any problems holding the lens with my left hand and taking shots with my right hand by touching the screen. It is not any worse than hitting the shutter button. I don't have to press hard.

0 upvotes

benny_wong, The touchscreen also fires the shutter on other cameras with this feature. You don't need three hands or whatever you're trying to say. Touching the screen is the same as releasing the shutter, with the camera focusing where you've chosen. It's a really fast and effective way to focus on your chosen area of the frame, without the camera deciding for you.

1 upvote

"The touchscreen also fires the shutter on other cameras with this feature"

It's usually an option to do focus or focus+shutter, yep. Especially useful in video mode too.

0 upvotes

When I switch from Nex 5N to 6 (and A6000 later), I didn't mis touch screen even though I used a lot tough screen with NEX 5N.

0 upvotes

@benny you hold the camera normally and use your thumb to move the AF point. It's much easier than either cursor pad or a joystick. Try it on a Panasonic (or now late Olympus models).

0 upvotes

What happened to the a6100 and a6200?

4 upvotes

The a6200 had IBIS, touch screen and proper splash-proof weather sealing. It was dropped because it was too perfect and bad for repeat business. It would also kill the APS-C DSLR market and that would offend existing customers.
#notserious

15 upvotes

They were going to release them, but since Canon kept releasing mirrorless turds, they didn't need to.

I'm sorry. I couldn't help myself.

23 upvotes

They will be released after the A6300 in Europe only as slight downgrades to the A6300, but have touch screen on one, and a headphone jack on the other, both missing the new AF system, with all three missing one of those new wonderful components. Then they will release the A6200 in USA after 4 months of customers wanting it, then the A6100 a week later 'due to popular demand'. Or, something.

Comment edited 58 seconds after posting

5 upvotes

Last year models, Sony canceled that

1 upvote

i for one am a fan of mirrorless turds

0 upvotes

cgarrard, Indeed. The Japanese camera company way is to give something and hold or take something away.

Comment edited 35 seconds after posting

2 upvotes

I am confused.. Isn't a6000 can do 11 fps with continuous autofocus?

0 upvotes

Yes the a6000 can also do 11 fps with C-AF.

0 upvotes

Like wow and awesome, fully sic even

0 upvotes

Don't forget to mention that for that 11 fps - you will have a total black-out of the EVF.

Basically making the 11fps option useless as you can't follow the subject through the viewfinder.

1 upvote

"Yes the a6000 can also do 11 fps with C-AF."-ish

0 upvotes

No, you don't have a "total black-out of the EVF" with A6000. It'll be showing the previous frame of the burst. It's not optimal for following a subject unless it's moving predictably given that means some lag, but it's far from useless as well.

2 upvotes

The videos are nice. The tracking is the most impressive amoung MLI. But if in the middle of shooting video, you want to change the focus point, you have to use the thumb pad step..step left step...step down and recording all the garbage in between, w/o a touch screen to control the AF pt.

2 upvotes

Yeah... lack of touchscreen is a real shame, as is a lack of a dedicated AF point joystick/control. There are so many nice UI elements you could design for AF point selection, I don't understand why we don't see much creativity here, or outright ignorance of its need altogether as is the case here.

8 upvotes

With all those AF points, where would a fat finger point for AF? It works well with a less dense pattern.

2 upvotes

Like Nikon's new high density AF sensor, not all points are selectable. Most of them work behind the scenes. You can use an AF box that can be adjusted to 3 different sizes and moved around the screen, but doesn't really represent any single or group of AF points.

0 upvotes

"or outright ignorance of its need altogether as is the case here"

Does that mean you discussed it with Sony and they didn't know what you were talking about?

0 upvotes

Gbased on a6000, a6300 ergonomics are more than fine. Tge real issue is native good e
Mount lens variety.

0 upvotes

And a well edited comment (j/k!). ;)

8 upvotes

:-p

0 upvotes

Such a shame Sony don't have any access to some better music for their videos.....

31 upvotes

Yes considering they're the largest music company

16 upvotes

Seriously. My ears still hurt.

12 upvotes

Yeah I'm glad you guys said something. It's still stuck in my head as I type, and I'm pining to find other music to listen too immediately after I finish this post, so it's stuck in my head instead. Then, I'm going to have some wine, put on "The Martian" and shoot some couch shots with my Canon 6D at ISO 25,600 that I'll end up deleting. Awesome.

3 upvotes

Recycled video game music. Stuck in my head playing endless loops.

4 upvotes

Sony, Y U NO DO touchscreen? Come on guys, we know you know how to do it, so what's the problem?

5 upvotes

Not all customers demand it.

4 upvotes

But it's what they're all saying in the DPR comments so IT MUST BE TRUE...

4 upvotes

I always bump them by accident, then wonder where my AF box went... -_____-

1 upvote

Not everyone demands it, but it seems like a natural fit to assign AF point, particularly because there's only unfortunate compromises to assign them with the current control system. Even stuck-in-the-mud CaNikon are going that way with their top of the line DSLRs.

0 upvotes

Not all customers demand it, but for some customers not having it is a deal breaker.

Honestly, the cat's out of the bag. The D5, D500, D5500 and 1DX II have one. The 5D IV will have one. All M4/3 cameras this directly competes against have one. The NX1 has one. Touch screens are an ergonomic user interface feature that appeal to amateurs and professionals alike.

... Even BlackBerry's got touchscreens eventually, guys.

1 upvote

common. Car that big, even original A7 will focus them in track. Just saying.

2 upvotes

then what about this?
https://youtu.be/lqY0YKmVuD0?t=30

0 upvotes

same awful music

4 upvotes

Why do people write "Common" when they mean "Come on"?

4 upvotes

Probably the same reason Sony can't follow a standard numbering sequence. :p

1 upvote

looks like the Canon 1DX2 can do twice the shots per second in live view. oh wait, it's 6x the price. hahaha

5 upvotes

You mistake one thing, 1DX2 can do 16 fps in "live view mode", but not with any live view feed on LCD during high speed continuous shot.
So, for fps, it is 11 fps vs 16 fps, 1DX2 is 50% faster, not twice.

btw. 1DX2 can do absolutely no AF-C during continuous shots in live view mode, while a6300 (and a6000) can do 11fps with AF-c

11 upvotes

The question is why would I need that in LV mode on a 1DX2... it has a pretty excellent optical view-finder afterall.

Don't get me wrong, I'm all for seeing technological improvement in mirrorless cameras...
just the comparison with a 1DX2 is a tad "tainted" in many regards...
different target audience and respective needs...
Whilst for work I don't need high FPS mostly with what I shoot - I need SOLID cameras... proven, tried and tested ergonomics I can operate without much thought or fumbling through menus.
I need a camera that works. works, and keeps working - even in dusty conditions etc.
also a bit of weight isn't a bad thing ergonomically - especially once you start attaching heavier lenses.

etc... comparing apples and oranges is what you're doing.

0 upvotes

the question is, why are you comparing the a6300 with the 1DX2...

13 upvotes

I strongly suspect that, for focus tracking (though maybe not acquisition) the 1DX2, and the D5 for that matter, will prove slightly better than this camera. I could be wrong, but I've got at least a little bit of faith in Canon and Nikon's decision to not abandon OVF and off-sensor phase-detect just yet. However, I definitely also believe that with technology like the A6300 AF coming out, the days are numbered. I bet at the next Olympic Games we'll see at least a few of these little Sony Alpha's...

1 upvote

No the 1D X II does not do 16 fps with Live View. It does it with everything blacked out - you can't even see what you're pointing your camera at.

Matt - agreed. Most mirrorless to-date still underperform in continuous drive modes. Which isn't to say its their C-AF that's underperforming, but more that AF likely has trouble making measurements off the same sensor that's being used to record the image. That image sensor has to constantly switch from image capture mode to whatever read-out mode is necessary to make focus measurements &track subjects, & during bursts I think that becomes difficult.

I believe this is partly why we noted extremely impressive C-AF with the a7R II, but decreased performance during actual bursts. With fast erratic subjects there'd be a whole bunch of shots in focus, then a whole set out of focus until the camera realized it was out of focus and refocused, then a whole bunch of shots in focus, etc.

DSLRs can suffer from this as well, but I think less so.

8 upvotes

Its has nice specs but specs aside, the ergonomics if similar to the A6000 stink for anything more than street photography or casual use. I tried one out in the store and could not believe how uncomfortable it was to hold for any period of time. Way too small for large telephotos, not enough body to grip without feeling like you may drop it if you have man sized hands. I am waiting for someone to build a larger body with much more battery capacity.

0 upvotes

If the 1dxII follows in the footsteps of the 7dII, the claimed fps could possibly be overstated.

0 upvotes

Well, I have a 7DII and if its overstated, its still flat out faster than almost any other camera. It gets the job done.

0 upvotes

Once you get on a monopod or gimbal head, I imagine the body would be just fine on a "big gun" tele lens

0 upvotes

Unless you don't or cannot use a gimbal or monopod. I shoot handheld all day with a 70-200mm and I added a grip to my 7D to make it MORE comfortable. Smaller is bad for ergonomics. I hope when Canon finally builds a pro level mirrorless they will start with a body the size of the 7D because for me, anything smaller is uncomfortable for anything but casual shooting.

0 upvotes

Unfortunately, you are in the minority on that one by a long shot. Unfortunately, I'm in that minority too at least part of the time, but not all of the time.

If at all possible, I'd highly recommend getting at least an ultralight monopod though. I shoot weddings full-time and even I thought that a monopod for my 70-200 2.8 was impractical, but after about 10 years my shoulder really started acting up from the same "stance" in supporting that lens, and I started using a monopod more. It has worked wonders for my shoulder, and is rather easy to do even in fast-paced scenarios. I was quite surprised at how easy it was to use a monopod in all sorts of action conditions.

0 upvotes

V1/V2 users smirk

0 upvotes

welp looks like im selling my soul for this.

4 upvotes

Your soul is $1000? Inexpensive

12 upvotes

rough times XD

20 upvotes

Souls are so damn cheap at the moment. Good luck finding a buyer.

7 upvotes

A few lenses as good flash some Sony shirts and bags....

0 upvotes

You sold both of your kidneys???

0 upvotes

operation is this weekend, dont worry boys ill pull through.

1 upvote

DOF looks pretty deep in this video, equal to about 3-4 seconds of motion of the car. This is based upon how much of the road appears to be in focus at any point in time.

5 upvotes

lol

6 upvotes

lol, how so? If it can track as well as the NX1's video AF then it will be very impressive. Here are some NX1 samples:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0DigAgYD-QY
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=znoDaqWLt9E

1 upvote

why don't you wait till the camera is out - try it and compare to the NX1

so silly pondering over a technology example clip sony posted on youtube

nothing you can learn from it

9 upvotes

That's fair but consider Sony is the source of the video, presumably so that the camera's tracking performance can be discussed as we're doing here.

2 upvotes

Discussed yes, but quantitatively assessed against another camera, seriously?

4 upvotes

It's a demonstration of video tracking from the actual camera - what else would we use to quantitatively evaluate it? We have tracking examples from other cameras so they can be compared. Part of that evaluation includes comparing the DOF used to see how wide the AF tracking envelope is.

1 upvote

If you think you can use a promo video to assess the quality of the AF system, good luck to you! To properly assess it (and compare it to anything else) you have to have a proper controlled test, lens focal length, aperture, AF settings, codec, camera set up, environmental conditions, etc. etc. this is a piece of video that demonstrates the concept... it might be crap, it might have a 1 mile wide DoF, but I wouldn't go around saying it was based on a marketing video.

2 upvotes

https://youtu.be/lqY0YKmVuD0?t=30

this one is cool.

0 upvotes

Classifying it as a promo video doesn't affect its applicability unless you believe Sony rigged the demonstration. I'm taking the video at face value, no different from any other source, which again includes comparing the DOF vs competing models in order to discount and compare its performance to other models.

1 upvote

See my earlier post... good luck!

0 upvotes

You stole my comment!

0 upvotes

Thanks @sibuzaru, looks impressive. The pigeon stays about the same distance from the camera so it's hard to evaluate AF engagement but the tracking looks impressive.

0 upvotes

Actually, in the second half it is mostly OOF. Pause it and you will see.

0 upvotes

@JACS, that looks more like motion blur than being OOF.

0 upvotes

There is no much of it at the beginning and it improves at 0:45 but it is bad somewhere in the middle.

0 upvotes

Agree with Horshack - I think in the bird example it's motion blur.

I was commenting more on the subject tracking, not depth tracking, which is hard to assess without knowing aperture, subject distance, etc.

Btw, we should really have some standardized terms for subject tracking vs. distance/depth tracking. Whenever someone says 'AF tracking' it's hard to tell what's being referred to!

1 upvote

Impressive videos!

7 upvotes

Why the hell Sony doesn't give touch screen to a video-oriented camera? Weird. Sony lacks touch screen and joysctick, Panasonic lacks Auto ISO in M mode and magnification during video recording. I am just expecting that Panasonic will fix this issue in the GH5

1 upvote

This was a sensor/software update, not a body update.
Very opportunistic update for sony since they made the sensor for the Xpro2. It should carry a6000 users over for a year or so until the dust settles and sony figures out where it wants to go with APSC.
Also, it should give a clue on how the Fuji XPro2 scores in the DXO metric. ;-)

4 upvotes

The body update is magnesium and weather sealing.

3 upvotes

@photomedium DXO does not test Fuji cameras or any of their X-Trans sensors.

Source, Jan. 26, 2016 PetaPixel article.

Comment edited 2 times, last edit 2 minutes after posting

1 upvote

jeremy,
right because of the X-trans. But since this is the same sensor without the xtrans, the raw DXO ISO and DR measured for this should be similar to the that of the Xpro2.

1 upvote

EthanP99,
I should have said form factor. If they included a touchscreen it would have been approached perfection. ;-)

1 upvote

@photomedium, I missed that half of your reply, whoops.

In my personal opinion, the idea of touchscreens has spoiled many photographers trying to shoot video. I get the simplicity and ease of use behind it, but I personally can't see an actual film crew using a touchscreen camera to shoot a film. The A6300 will probably be able to utilize Eye AF in AF-C so you could probably get tack sharp videos and interviews every time (with my A7Rii I have no problems with the AF-C in video in both Eye AF and non-Eye AF uses) so this should feasibly perform quite well in those cases, and an incredibly high functioning auto-focus system that will work for others (and then there's focus magnification and peaking in manual/DMF).

Comment edited 3 minutes after posting

2 upvotes

Touch screen is not only for touch-to-AF pull, but for touch-to-magnify while recording to adjust focus with MF especially when filming with excellent MF lenses with real focus rings. Touch screen is excellently useful for solo video shooters; all Sony/Canon/Panasonic video cameras have brilliant touch operability for decades: I guess there is good reason. Of course, excellent face detect AF-C mitigates the pain of no touch screen, somehow.
Sony alpha cameras are the only cameras with great video features without touch screen, really weird. The masses will not buy no-touch screen cameras any more.

Comment edited 2 minutes after posting

0 upvotes

Yup I couldn't do Auto ISO in S / A mode in the GF series. Such a slap-forehead omission

0 upvotes

Let's see this work on a fast telephoto wide-open though.

1 upvote

Thats probably what they shot it on.

1 upvote

that race car shot, for example, doesn't look like a 200 f/2.8 at all. It looks more like they shot it mebbe 100mm at f/11. Not impressed.

4 upvotes

Because you can always tell?

2 upvotes

your name says it all lol

2 upvotes

The continuous autofocus doesn't wander on my xt10 either...bif done recently on a flock of gulls,,my cam kept my intended subject in focus...I'm happy...but,,mirrorless tech advances and the autofocus here does look impressive...

0 upvotes

Most mirrorless cameras are easily performing in that kind situations even without PDAF.

Its just that Sony marketing department leftovers are swallowed so easily without crunching.

1 upvote

X-T10? Most mirrorless cameras even without PDAF?

That's just not true.

4 upvotes

so...Sony FF has the R line for resolution, the S line for sensitivity, and the all-a-rounder line (a7 i/ii).
now Sony has 'made' a new premium line EF mount and the new AF marvel a6300.
mighty interesting stuff from Sony.
could we expect a new Sony FF "a?" line for fast fast action or will the fast focusing stuff of the a6300 remain on APS-C and/or simply 'trickle' up to current FF line.

1 upvote

Looks promising! As the original A6000 already was and still is! But Sony what about lenses... The are HUGE, most of them. They are EXPENSIVE beyond being realistic. This could be an awesome sports-camera. But there is a lack of bright tele lenses for these ape-c bodies. I mean + 300mm

0 upvotes

Would you buy a 300 2.8? Do you have $4000?

2 upvotes

a bright 300mm? is the 300/2.8 not bright enough? ;-)

2 upvotes

There's a 300mm f/2.8 Sony lens that works with the LA-EA1/EA3 adapter ring. Be prepared to break the bank. ;-)

0 upvotes

price of lenses will not chance, size of lenses will not change. if you want a "bright" lens it will be big, if its big, it will be expensive.

4 upvotes

I know there is a 300mm/f2.8. But Sony should make more APS-c lenses which you can use without an expensive adapter.

Also Sony full-frame lenses are in no way more compact as dslr lenses.

A 100-300mm f3.5/f5.6 lens for the A6300/A6000 etc must be possible.

The same with the Sony A7 bodies. Marvelous cameras, sensor and technique! But those lenses.. Big, heavy, expensive. Lucky you can use many manual focus lenses, like some pancakes. But without AF of course.

I mean Sony is on the roll, they do a really good job. And yes there are quiet some lenses now. But I miss more pancake primes and more.

0 upvotes

Long tele lenses will be similar in size and weight when designed for FF or APS-C. Hence why you won't see long APS-C tele lenses for Canon or Nikon bodies either. There's simply no point designing them when the FF version will look and do pretty much the same.

2 upvotes

At 300mm even if it was made for APS-C the size would be almost as big, and wouldn't be much cheaper.

See Sony/Fuji 90mm.

1 upvote

Technically it must be possible! They just seem not to invest time and funds in it. Check the pretty old Canon 70-300mm DO version lens. That is quiet compact for a 70-300mm lens.

But lucky the Sony 70-200mm/f4 suits the A6000/A6300 pretty well.

0 upvotes

WACONimages,

Mirrorless or DSLR lens, size will not change, you can't change physics, you still need big piece of glass to let the light in.

And as far as DO is concerend even Canon gave up on it, its hard to produce, Its more expensive, normal 70-300 at that time was 500ish, while the DO version was over a 1,000.

And DO picture quality wasn't good, so its not a messiah you been hoping for.

1 upvote

How's the whole canon lens compatibility with this? Is it in line with the A7RII??

0 upvotes

Looks to have the same as system

I am hoping for the same -2ev or better

1 upvote

If it's the same as the a7R II, it's -2 EV for phase-detect AF with F2.0 lenses, or thereabouts in our testing. Adjust +/- X EV for X EV slower or faster lens, as a rule of thumb.

1 upvote

> If it's the same as the a7R II

My a6000 + Metabones IV focuses nothing like in your a7RII tests, unfortunately. Huge hunting, very slow.

After Metabones FW upgrade, Canon 50/1.4 finally started to work, somehow (even though it was not supposed to, at all, according to the note on Metabones site at the time of my purchase). But that's about the only positive change.

And I'm talking about shooting in good light. So... out of all my Canon glass, the only practical value is 70-300 DO for compressed landscapes.

0 upvotes

Damn you Sony! I just bought new gear. Couldn't you have announced this a few weeks earlier? Oh well. Nice tech.

Comment edited 22 seconds after posting

2 upvotes

Dammit Sony - stop making it super hard for me to justify sticking with my Nikon DX bodies.

3 upvotes

Wow, it can now do what Samsung, Olympus and Panasonic could do last year!

+1 to Rishi too. "A smaller 70-200 F2.8 APS-C lens, or longer, would be great."
And one that doesn't cost $3000. But that ain't happening this decade.

4 upvotes

Last we checked, no they couldn't. Not at these frame rates. But please correct me if I'm wrong and I'll go back and check.

25 upvotes

I think we should be hoping Sony doesn't do what Samsung did last year!

9 upvotes

E-M1 managed since start but only at 6.5 frames per second so you are right that not with those framerates (8fps) and when firmware 3.0 was released it just got even better in accuracy (about 90-100% keeper rate) and framerates went from 6.5 up to 9-10 (it is little over 9fps by timers).

And the firmware 4.0 added 11fps with electronic shutter and it isn't a problem with those camera angles where there really isn't so much movement and the subjects are very clearly separated from the backgrounds, almost like tracking a red ball against blue wall.

But what makes sony different is that it can do C-AF + Tracking at 11 fps while E-M1 is limited to 6.5 fps while C-AF + Tracking. Meaning user needs to track the subject by itself while using continuous autofocus at 11fps. So it can do 11fps with the C-AF and even with same success rate (I shoot rally when the season is)!

And when did the 4.0 firmware come out for E-M1? It was last year :D

3 upvotes

"A smaller 70-200 F2.8 APS-C lens, or longer, would be great."
And one that doesn't cost $3000. But that ain't happening this decade.

It's not happening any decade, they won't get smaller, cost will go up, as inflation goes up so does cost.

0 upvotes

@Mk82, I think the articles and Rishi means provding 8fps with live view feed in EVF, not max fps with af or not

0 upvotes

The EM1 does indeed provide a live view feed in the EVF at 6.5fps with C-AF.
In addition the VF blackout time is shorter than my ex-5DIII in silent mode, and at worst quite close to it in normal mode, and the shutter lag is shorter than the 5DIII in regular mode.
I'm fairly confident though that, in addition to the 1.5fps faster continuous drive mode with live view feed, the A6300 will have better C-AF and subject tracking. It's not that great on the EM1 in my opinion.
What I'd like to know, if the hypothesis that the X-pro 2 and the A63000 share a similar sensor is confirmed, is why Fuji is limited to 3 fps with live view feed (according to DPreview) and if that bodes well for future firmware updates or newer bodies progressively "unlocking" performance.

Comment edited 1 minute after posting

0 upvotes

Good point about the E-M1 - that's one of the higher fps ones with some form of live view in between shots. I think we're talking about a different class of overall, mainly AF, performance though. Also the smaller sensor, etc.

And technically, the Nikon 1 has no blackouts at all! But practically speaking, it wasn't pushing boundaries in this regard with its very limited lens set, extensive depth-of-field, etc.

With the a6300, I think we're not only seeing the next evolution of this technology that will make mirrorless competitive against DSLR for action shooting, but also seeing it in a camera that may give actual, close to DSLR performance - that a wildlife or sports photographer used to shooting higher-end (still sub-pro) DSLRs just might be willing to consider trying.

...

0 upvotes

...

But it'll all depend on actual performance and implementation. Lock-on AF has been known to be too far too erratic, but depth-based subject tracking has been DSLR-level on the a7R II (perhaps better). Problem with the latter on Sony cameras though is that it's only been available in Wide AF area mode, which few enthusiasts/pros would use since it gives no control over your starting point. In fact, my biggest worry for Sony cameras is that great tech will be rendered next-to-useless by poor implementations... it's certainly happened before (Center Lock-on AF, but not Lock-on AF: Center in video, for example).

0 upvotes

Well, I'm not versed well enough in Sony cameras to know the intricacies of some of their behaviours, but don't you think the A6300's technology is already compromised by what appears to be poor controls ? What's the point of technology if its usability isn't maximised because of sub-par design ?

Here we have what appears to be amazing AF / live view technology, in a body that isn't even a match in terms of action controls for Sony's own DSLR line. Nobody's expecting the ergonomics of a larger camera, but wouldn't it have been nice to introduce, for example, a joystick, like on Sony's own DSLRs ?

And that's just the start, because there's a lot more to action controls than just a proper access to AF point selection.

I don't want to be too critical of Sony though, most cameras have poor UI / ergonomics / controls anyway. *hem* PEN-F AF-ON button *hem*.

0 upvotes

6.5 fps vs 8 is nothing. Just 1.5fps.

And with 11fps C-AF without live view you are having 90ms lag that allows you still totally perfectly track the subject without problems.

0 upvotes

Well, it provides a 24mp sensor live view feed at 8fps vs a 16mp sensor feed at 6.5fps, is that really insignificant ?
But I don't think it's just 1.5fps that the A6300 is likely to do better.
Shutter lag will be much, much shorter, since the shutter mechanism doesn't have to perform a full shutter cycle when using electronic first curtain (that's been solved on newer Olympus cameras, but not the EM1, it's hardware I believe).
Maybe blackout time too will be shorter than the EM1.
And I'd be very surprised if the A6300 didn't turn out to be better at C-AF and subject tracking given my experience with the EM1.

0 upvotes

@MayaTlab0 The E-M1 has EFCS in low speed burst mode and full electronic shutter in both high and low speed burst mode as of the v4.0 firmware update.

0 upvotes

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Panasonic and Fujifilm reveal joint sensor development, offering global shutter Feb 4, 2016	Hands on with Sony's a6300 and G Master lenses Feb 3, 2016	Video: A quick look at the Sony a6300 Feb 3, 2016	Oh, wow... Sony announces 24MP a6300 with incredible AF and 8 fps live view bursts Feb 3, 2016

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