Let's lampoon our politicians

Doesn’t David Cameron remind you of Lord Snooty in the Beano? Doesn’t the Baronet Osborne remind you of Piers Fletcher-Dervish, Alan B’Stadard’s sniveling sidekick? Doesn’t Boris Johnson comes across as a completely insincere, feckless fool, just like his TV persona? Aren’t they, all 3, landed layabouts and former members of the elitist, yobbish Bullingdon Club?

Didn’t Lord Snooty cop a huge mouthful of clunking fist at today’s PMQ – especially when he ventured onto the economy (at last)? Lots of slogans and absolutely no substance.

Doddy was guilty . . .

"Piers Fletcher-Dervish"

That’s a Blast From The Past! Had to search the net hard to find a picture:

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1061/646473641_144df560c0_o.gif

You could always do a double Act Ken with that Margaret Becket Chick, and could
share and eat the same apple through a Tennis Racket in the interval,and discuss the Tax Racket thats going on? You know its all written in Welsh ? just turn that paper upside down,then turn it over,then hold it up to the light,then read it off from left to right,of course the Irish have to go one better,there the Tax receipts are written with a dipstick,for a dipstick ,by a dipstick and given to a Cone Head,who works in Scotland on the Roads ,for Branson trains,for final approval by another Cone Head and family,who have been traced to the Village of Cone Heads in Cornwall on the Isle of Silly Buggers annexed to the Isle of Great Branston.Who,s Trains dont run on time as they are flying through the air after an administrative fault by Jimmy Savile,who is the walking Jewlery Store owner,or the local pickpocket.

It looks like it.

Yes, hello Gordon!

are you referring to the 300g’s in notes he kept in a suitcase under his bed?

Lord Snooty always won in the end.

Possibly the comic has been taken over by the Nu labour party for their future issues of the party Manifesto or issuing instructions from the EC.

Great idea, we could do the same for Islam too.

Politicians need (and generally have) no qualifications for the posts they hold. A Transport Secretary this week can become Health Secretary the next, thus becoming the nation’s "expert" on the brief. Lampooning them has a healthy history – Gillray’s cartoons come to mind. Gordon and his brown-nosers are caricatures in their own right and wonderful material for comedians. Can someone introduce that man to a tailor?

And another thing about Snooty is that he wasn’t snooty. His gang was made up entirely from the ordinary children of the neighbourhood. His adventures were with the ordinary folk and against privilege. He didn’t assert privilege – he overthrew it. He was also a tireless anti-fascist. And as Horseman points out he always won. Hazel – it’s quite obvious you know nothing about Lord Snooty. Have you actually read the Beano?

Didn’t trust the bank,clever Doddy.

I quite agree – now what is your opinion of the Bean’s scary facial grimace with the new dental apparatus that frightens (quite rightly) small children and horses?
Not to forget the jaw-drop like a fiddler’s elbow* that so neatly encapsulates his impression of a just landed fish.
I expect soon we wil have the opportunity to lampoon him on his expenses, which it seems it is possible the "im notan accountant" cretin "has made a mistake with".

Bean’s on toast soon!*

*Copyright the excellent Mrs Trellis

Interesting that Hazel Tree got in first on this one with her usual tired Bullingdon jibes and caricatures borrowed from Private Eye. Funny how she didn’t mention the Supreme Leader,his Broonites and the appaling Jock Mcsporen and Fem Dom clubs that run Nulabour. Hazel also seems naively unaware that national sentiment is running strongly against her favourite team and all they stand for and many of us would rather have Cameron at any price if it means getting rid of this dreadful bunch of no hopers amd D graders and their dreary oppressive Stalinist regime. Latest from the People’s Party -note how the craven Nulabour cannon fodder have blocked an enquiry into the Iraq disaster which would show them all up – not a true democrat or an honest man or woman left among among them! Oh and does anybody know if the Labour party actually pays Hazel Tree to haunt these blogs with her dreary Labour cheer leading?

Yes Labour do pay the ghastly droning Tree, which is quite illegal, which is why she resolutely refuses to deny it. Dee is also paid indirectly as is Quietzapple (or Quackers).

"are you referring to the 300g’s in notes he kept in a suitcase under his bed?"

Thought it was another Bojo scandal for a mo . . .

Ah well, another day, another euro!

you may be forced to admit that Macaroon is less impressive than Lord Snooty qua Beano is/was.

You have been getting rather soft on these tories recently, Lord Cashcroft’s shilling I suppose . . .

prob cares not at all that an enquiry into the second Iraq War will begin at a more appropriate time, and no doubt be more complete than the current security situation would allow.

"Oh and does anybody know if the Labour party actually pays Hazel Tree to haunt these blogs with her dreary Labour cheer leading?"

It wouldn’t matter to her arguments if she was, would it? (well, electoral laws aside, anyway). Remember that cartoon from the Bubble era?

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/f/f8/Internet_dog.jpg

We can listen to the barks and woofs and determine the merits of the argument on its own: ideas exist independently of the person who puts them forward.

Why should we pay for it though? The laws are there for a very good reason, to prevent taxpayers being exposed to propaganda at their own expense, which will inevitably favour the party holding the purse-strings.
Nu-Liebour are very cavalier about which laws they choose to obey – reminds me of any Fascist Govt of the past you care to mention.
Mrs Tree and her employers are engaged in a criminal conspiracy, which she seems quite anable to answer to, confirm or deny.

This is typical of the wierd eulogies that the good Lord Bullers of Snootville attracts. He’s the ultimate faute de mieux.

You may have noticed His Lordship raising the economy at PMQ’s today — and received a rather large clunking fist in the chops for his trouble.

Like it or not, the US recession raises the stakes now. It means the choice actually really matters. It takes away the "Time for a Change" mentality amongst the floaters.

Bearing in mind that all the records for highest taxes, highest Gov spend, highest unemployment, biggest stock market crash, biggest property crash,….yawn…are Tory, you get the picture.

Just as the PM sent him packing today, with interest, I think the electorate will be peering through the smoke and mirrors, the lack of substance, the lies about re-cycling and taxes, the absence of any experience of a real life, the spin, the re-branding and re-re-branding, the Green-Blue Tree,…….and will see something really quite pointless.

The best he can muster, after 11 years of Labour, is to be better than nothing. What a guy.

Noe that Lord Snoot doesn’t allow himself to play the Europ or immigration cards – the traditional TYory bankers. Wonder how that will play out with the usual rightwingers.

I suspect they might eventually realise that they would be better represented by a few UKIP/BNP types in the Commons. Especially if the LAbour majority narrows. Especially if a hung Parliament is on the cards.

That would be the worst of all worlds, of course.

i have told you 3 times now that i receive brown paper envelopes postmrked Belize. the amount contained therein is proportionate to the number of times you call the Prime Minister a one-eyed, homosexual paedophile.

my crumb of comfort is that at least you can distinguish between a homosexual and a paedophile. your lots often get confused by that one.

or ar you already paid by your employer in euros. That would be quite legal of course.

Complains that Cameron has an "absence of any experience of a real life".

Tell us Ms Tree the CV of McBean the student anarchist’s experience of real life. Monocular by accident, vision-impaired by design, this non-accountant cretin who has thrown away Britain’s chances of recovery for a generation has only managed a treatise on how to rip companies off, and live for nothing off the back of the working population. I discount his book on "Courage", because the bottler as we all know is a stranger to the concept, ghostwritten or not, and his much vaunted "vaaahhlluews" are none that any thinking taxpayer shares.

Face it Tree, it’s Bean’s on toast soon.

Hazel – any chance of coming clean about your complete ignorance of the Beano and Lord Snooty? No – you prefer to peddle fantasy and lies just like your paymaster. But you will learn the hard way that people don’t take kindly to be treated like fools and you and your rotten to the core party will pay the price. A price that is rising just as fast as the rate of inflation.

Hazel tree: ‘the amount contained therein is proportionate to the number of times you call the Prime Minister a one-eyed, homosexual paedophile’
You get that much !!
I am putting in for a rise !!

I apologise sincerely for using that name so often in connection with one Rt Hon David Cameron MP, Leader of Her Majesty’s Official Opposition. Whilst I had imagined there to be similarities, it would appear that David Cameron is half the man that Lord Snooty, war hero and champion of ‘keeping it real’, is the ‘toon. DC does try to keep it real, but seems not to understand that few people can afford to buy $700 baseball shoes, meaning that he is ‘keeping it unreal’. or should that be ’surreal’?

cycling to work — keeping it real — but followed by his car with suits and work papers — unrreal!!

paying 5 grand to strap a windturbine to his house, yet not even bothering to instruct the butler to split out landfill from recycle in his own bins — surreal!!

maybe one day i will wake up and find that i just had this silly dream that the Tories had been taken over by 3 Bullingdon Yobs. one of them, with a 2:2 in History, looked positively suprised today at PMQ’s to find that the US actually runs a deficit!! he almost said "Crikey!!!!" but he only wants to be Chancellor of the Exchequer.

weird and inconsistent for people to claim that Gordon is Stalinist and then that off message bloggers on the Dilly Telegraph are paid by a party which cannot find two farthings to rub together.

The accusations are a form of bullying, used in retaliation for losing arguments, by those who lose arguments.

"cycling to work — keeping it real — but followed by his car with suits and work papers — unrreal!! "

Some people cycle because they enjoy it. Try it. You might like it too.

that you have mever mentioned Hazel.
During the 80’s ,Thatcher years, emmigation to Canada and Australia from the UK was the lowest in the the 1900′. Canada was about 5000 per year . Care to state the figure now and the reason why it is so high?

you are seriously telling me that that elitist layabout is not taking people for a ride with all the compassionate crap he spouts. he’s passionate about one thing – himself. you lot only support him because there is a 0.001% chance that he might cut income tax. let’s all be honest about it.

if he does, he is again taking people for a ride because the Tories have finally, finally, finally realised that normal people care for the public services and use them. any income tax cut redistributes income the wrong way and eats into public services.

Lord Snooty is taking everyone for a ride.

"my crumb of comfort is that at least you can distinguish between a homosexual and a paedophile".

You are right I can, which is why I said McBean is a homosexual with a sham marriage, but have never accused him of being a paedophile, simply because I dunno. What I do know is that the government he "leads" so disastrously has consistently given aid and comfort to paedophiles, and thus I find the whole rotten crew suspect. Most ordinary voters would prefer that their government share their life standards, and at least not have deviancy concealed from them, that they can make informed choices.
Bean is VERY well aware of this, which is why he dissembles.

the people that could afford the airfare were benefitting from trickle down taxation? you know, the sort of taxation that replicates Indian style income inequality in the end.

did you realise that there are 300,000 French people living and working in England, and that the Lycee is seriously oversubscribed?

do you have a handle on the number of Antipodeans that are currently in this country? Or Americans? I’ll bet there are far more Yanks here than there were under Iron Knickers. Google the numbers and we’ll see.

some people cycle to pretend that they’re just a regular guy. some – the same – also to pretend that they are ‘green’ when, quite palpably, they are not.

have you tried that kind of cycling. fake cycling? perhaps Britain’s indigeneous guest sport at the London Olympics could be a variation on the Bullingdon cycling scam.

cycling, followed by a chauffeur driven car, the wrong way up London’s one way tracks, through reds,…..?

thanks. that’s another 1BZD towards my cost of living.

a question instead.

You first paragraph is totally weird. and I have not a clue what you are talking about

As for ‘Iron Knickers’ I sure Mrs Thatcher would take that as a compliment. They don’t come off too quickly.

45goat does not deny that his only purpose in life is to silence dissent. he goads and tries to turn any semblance of discussion into ad hom, invective and Hill Billy garble. i got wise to that a while back.

thing is – this is such a frivolous thread, that i see little harm in letting him have a little fun. if it were about something serious, i would ignore him. it’s the best way.

i’m just surprised that his alter-avatar hasn’t swung by yet with some tutting and a tirade of his pious old claptrap. this thread is simply made for Shameless/JamesStrachan and the use of the word ‘cretin’. still time yet.

Hazel Tree admits she never read the Beano, doesn’t know anything about Lord Snooty (but has reverted to using the Lord Snoot ‘jibe’ anyway) and also knows nothing about surrealism. The political allegiance of the surrealists may have veered from Trotskyism to Anarchism, but one thing is certain, they always stood for the redistribution of wealth. Mmmm – not doing too well with those insults are you Hazel?

not a question. a guess at an answer to your question.

‘wierd’? you mean you do not understand what the Tories did last time?

which bit seems wierd and i will elaborate with sources and any other supporting proof you might need.

it’s a story that needs to be told.

if it helps you out, substitute ‘bizzare’ for its synonym ’surreal’ and re-read the post.

Hazel, you are far from the Carter approved narrative today. Have you read the briefing note that the No.10 bunker sent out this morning? Carter wants to stop all this class-war stuff. Doesn’t play well with aspiring voters dont’cha know. The 70’s class warriors that are still around love it but they will already vote labour or green.
I guess you don’t care and are aligned with the Balls/Cooper duo who want to fight it out down n’ dirty contrary to what Carter wants.
NuLab is now splitting into factions.
The Balls/Cooper duo who (to their credit) are not giving up and are going to fight. They don’t accept the game is up and fear 10-20 years in opposition and the effective end of their political careers.
The Carter led group around No.10 who want to fight but not dirty as they don’t think it works plus they suspect the game may be up and are basically in shore-up mode.
The axis forming around Milliband senior and rockin’ Al J who think the game is up, fuelled by the helpful interventions of Charles Clarke and are preparing for the succession fight post-Brown.
Hazel – it’s going to get much worse, think John Major is 1995. A weak and vacillating PM presiding over a party fearful of a major loss of power and privilege, and senior politicians aligning themselves for future sucession.
Joyful! Bring it on.

Please tell. Im aways open to the truth.
And while you at it tell me why UK emmigration was so low in the 80’s

I carried out some research (ie Wiki LOL) and it appears that most paedophilia is by men of their daughters or other young girls.

Rather as murder is more likely to be of someone the murderer knows, a relative quite possibly, the most unlikely crime is the one which is highlit by the ignorant.

It is an irony that Lord Snooty has some idea of being a decent and straightforward man, even if he cannot make it on some scores. Yet his party is still pretty damn nasty in many corners, under its coldest stones . . .

Most people in this day and age are tolerant of gays, and of homosexuals, regarding such matters as private in broad terms.

Only a few libertarians will tolerate anything to do with paedophilia of any kind.

I do suspect that 45% er is very out of touch with opinion in "the old country."

she removed them twice in her life and look what we got: a gunrunner and a cross between Ann Widdecombe and Vanessa Feltz. i hear that Cecil Parker tried the welding kit on them.

The Tories lowered direct taxes and raised indirect taxes. This mean that the burden of taxation was pushed down the chain, toward the poor. The rich got richer, the poor poorer. if you want sources, they can be supplied.

the effect, of course, was recession. there was supposed to be an off-set between extra money in pockets (lower direct taxes) and higher prices (she greatly increased VAT to pay for this scheme).

it didn’t work. recession.

my speculative answer to your question about immigration is that, in those days before budget airlines and cheaper flights generally, perhaps those that could afford to leave were delighted to stay because they knew that Iron Briefs would look after them.

These are the same people who will have benefitted from the nationalisations. the sale of public assets at a discount. BAA was sold for c.£2bn in today’s money. it is now worth about £9bn in today’s money. have they discovered oil at Heathrow?

is that an answer? if not, please feel free to ask more.

all of which brings me back to a common theme – how many people that post here are actually in touch with the modern Tory Party?

Dave seems to have made the assumption that he will get the ‘real’ Tory vote as of right, on pure tribal grounds. he does not seem to acknowledge that UKIP/BNP exist, or that they could actually make a difference. Underpants Major relied upon the Official Unionists for a time. Jim Molyneaux PM. or was it Trimble? can’t remember.

i certainly don’t think Dave would regard 45goat’s narrative as being on-message or Tory.

A question that might be worth asking is this. How many of these emigrants will come back here just in time to avail themselves of NHS treatment? We’ll see.

I suppose the belize ranger pays you to upset UKIP and BNP likely voters in the hope they will vote Tory then?

Surrealism as a political movement was interesting,Andre Breton was its "formal" leader (LOL) for a fair while.

I like the idea that objects like cars "which have ceased to serve" might be disposed of underwater, not terribly eco friendly though.

I’ll give you a brouny point on the son.I walked right in on that one.

With regard to your ‘Speculative’ answer I’m sure you have been taking lessons from the civil servent in ‘Yes Minister’ or possibly you wrote the script. All I can say is ‘Crap’

"I don’t know whether the 45% er is homosexual or a paedophile either but he certainly routinely raises both matters on blogs which are irrelevant to those subjects."

Let me refer you to the FIRST mention of the subject by Ms Tree above @ 15.27 :-

"i have told you 3 times now that i receive brown paper envelopes postmrked Belize. the amount contained therein is proportionate to the number of times you call the Prime Minister a one-eyed, homosexual paedophile."

Now Quackers how can you expect me to ignore an open invitation like that? As they say in court – you opened that door….

you aren’t denying raising those subjects almost routinely on blogs on all sorts of subjects then?

Horseman @ 15.30:

I can’t say that the subjects raised with great persistence in this blog – from either side – are ever raised when I talk to the general public.

They talk about falling incomes, rising taxes and a Government that says "So What".

No, thank you, Hazel.

None of us believe them.

"All I can say is ‘Crap’"

maybe you could give me a competing theory? have you any knowledge of global migration to share? has it increased or decreased recently? i’ll never understand it. why would someone go live in Asutralia or Spain when they can hang out here in the pissing rain. mad, they are. plain mad.

one of my chums is coming back from Spain after 3 years. apparently, the schools and Uni’s are crap out there. he’s eaten several large buckets of humble pie since announcing his return.

all i can say is ‘crap’ too. once they go, ban them from future use of the public services or make them pay their back dues.

i didn’t start the Blog. as i said above, it is a bit silly. nothing wrong with silly every now and then, i suppose.

main thing is 45goat called the PM a one-eyed, homosexual paedophile again, so i get sent another 1BZD from Belize.

"all i can say is ‘crap’ too. once they go, ban them from future use of the public services or make them pay their back dues"

What "back dues" do you think would be appropriate for adult foreign immigrants Hazel, especially the ones that do not speak the language?

‘want’ to believe them, make that.

you don’t ‘want’ to believe them because they clearly show that the Tories, in addition to recessions and negative equity and cuts in services, deliver taxes and big government and big deficits and big debt.

they hold all the records, as you will see in the FT, HMT, the OECD, the IMF and the ONS.

do you want me to be banned from posting such statistics? can you yourself look at these statistics and convince anyone that they do not show that the Tories give us recessions and negative equity, cuts in services, big taxes, big government, big deficits, big debt and big income equality.

in case you have missed the news, the world’s largest economy by a country mile is in recession – a recession that is being compared, quite seriously, to the Great Depression.

that measn there are real stakes to play for. the Tories and their ideology? make sense to you? not to me. no siree.

"main thing is 45goat called the PM a one-eyed, homosexual paedophile again, so i get sent another 1BZD from Belize"

WHERE did I say it Hazel? – YOU raised the subject, not I. Boy, you ZaNuLab aspparatciks don’t think anyone pays attention do you? The evidence is above. Don’t lie.

i was being somewhat facetious about returning migrants; but it does not surprise me that you missed it.

now, can you please describe the Prime Minister as a one-eyed homosexual paedophile one more time today? you know that my meagre stipend depends upon it.

would you be happier if i say you described him as a one-eyed homosexual who is probably a paedophile?

let’s hone this one.

I already have Hazel, try to keep up. I repeat what I say above:-

"I said McBean is a homosexual with a sham marriage, but have never accused him of being a paedophile, simply because I dunno. What I do know is that the government he "leads" so disastrously has consistently given aid and comfort to paedophiles, and thus I find the whole rotten crew suspect."

HazelTree: In the absence the usual multitude of bloggers telling us how well Lord Snooty did at PMQ can I assume that today he was really bad ?

He did what these chumps want. He mentioned the economy. Reminds me of that Fawlty Towers goose-stepping sketch. That one is strictly taboo.

Hazel, David,

Why don’t you just talk by the water cooler instead of posting yourt comments here.

Actually, David was rather good. I would thinhk that and you would think the opposite.

But Gordon wasn’t very impressive. He chose not to answer questions on the FSA – who have themselves admitted in a report today that their supervision of Northern Rock failed.

And he told a direct lie when he asserted that David Cameron was economic adviser to Norman Lamont.

There is rather more needed to run a Government than bluster, lies and tractor statistics.

my homosexual friends have confirmed to me on numerous occasions that not only are they not physically incapable of performing the procreative act with a lady, but they would find it really quite horrible. In much the same way a heterosexual person would do if forced to have homosexual sex, i suppose.

the Prime Minister has already sired twice — unless you think Darling was persuaded to cover his ‘guilty secret’, and i would put nothing past the depths of to fantasy to which you would sink.

perhaps you need to start calling the PM a one-eyed, bi-sexual, probable paedophile.

of course, he’s not one-eyed either. he hs 2, but one is made prosthetic.

perhaps, it’s time you called the PM a ‘prosthetically-eyed, bi-sexual, probable paedophile’. trips off the tongue, that one.

the truth about Dave is actually worse, suggesting it was a genuine error. so i will leave it to you to tell us what Dave was actually doing for Chancellor Black Wednesday Lamont. what was his real ‘job’?

To answer Hazel’s query at 17:42, David Cameron was a Special Adviser giving general support to Normamn Lamont just like Ed Balls, James Purnell, Ed Milliband and David Milliband and Shriti Vadera were (to other ministers) in their time.

Now, as Harold Wilson would have said, let’s talk about the realissues :-

Falling Incomes
Rising Prices
Inaccurate Measures of Inflation
Rising Taxes
Rising borrowing
Borrowing off the balance sheet( Network Rail, Northern Rock, PFI)
Unfunded Commitments (public sector pensions)

It’s raining and the roof is leaking.

Gosh Hazel – your ignorance knows no bounds. Suffice it to say that there are many many many gay men who are married and have sired children. It is a fact of life. I make no further comment.

Is Hazel Tree is an antiestablishmentism nut?

Ed Balls was an "Economic advisor"

Macaroon was a "Special Advisor"

ie bag carrier at Black wednesday.

Probably a student, from all the time (s)he has to post guff. I’d guess at a second year st a former polytechnic, ’studying’ something which ends in ‘ology’ or ’studies’ and has 5 hours timetabled a week.

(Quietzapple 26 Mar 2008 13:13)

So let’s just remind ourselves: "An accused person is presumed innocent until proved guilty beyond reasonable doubt by the prosecution." http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/Gtgl1/GuideToGovernment/Judiciary/DG_4003099

Doddy was not proved guilty beyond reasonable doubt by the prosecution.

Is it not TYPICAL of the Nulabour appologists that they should treat our personal rights and freedoms in such a cavalier way?

"That was the week that was" will probably also remember that it was like water off a duck’s back as this rather silly blog is.

No Ed Balls was a SpAD. In the same way the Cameron was, and Milliband, and Purnell and so on. Being a SpAd is the entry point into the political class.
Hazel – BTW I though Cameron was good, Brown was at his usual low standards. And he lied yet again.
He better watch out. We have seen the Clinton lied video doing the rounds and Brown will get the same treatment at the next election.
Theres a great clip of Brown claiming "low inflation" cut with Sir Michael Rose stating that for his customers inflation is really about 8%

It is difficult to believe that there can be a real person capable of such stupidity as the Hazel postings. She makes cretins like Prescott seem semi intelligent. If she is a real person and the best to be put up by our Scottish Socialist masters to try to answer our sheer loathing of the current government with people like the Bottler, his glove puppet Darling, Gorbals Mick, etc. then just imagine what the rest of them must be like.

How about the moralising Jelly Kelly? She is so easy to ridicule. Take gay adoption as an example.

Because she has Popish views, she objected to her government’s proposal. But as she valued her career above her principles, she caved-in to Tony Blair. The irony is that Blair became a papist himself!

Macaroon a Special Advisor.

If it was wrong I expect some folk wouldn’t be so touchy about it, and Wiki would have been corrected by now, Macaroon being who he is, Bullingdon relo to Queen etc.

do you think someone who spends their whole time posting that the Prime Minister is a one-eyed, homosexual paedophile is a cretin?

please advise.

adjective
her deranged cousin has finally been locked up insane, mad, disturbed, unbalanced, unhinged, unstable, irrational; crazed, demented, berserk, frenzied, lunatic, certifiable; non compos mentis; informal touched, crazy, wacko, mental, psycho. antonym rational.

if you delve into the last ONS report, you will see that inflation in certain items of food is in double digits. Leisure and footwear is deflating.

if we spent all our money on eggs, inflation would be 16%. we don’t.

would be absolutely delighted to discuss all of these in great detail. how do we ensure, however, that we will not be trested to more ‘one-eyed, homosexual paedophile’ abuse — intended to disrupt any serious debate? ideas on a postcard.

have you ever noticed the 45% er or any of his alter ids posting during our morning?

Bermuda prob 5 hrs behind us.

Hazel Tree 26 Mar 2008 19:20

There is absolutely nothing to stop you discussing the real issues – except your own failure to do so.

I have no idea who other posters are and I deplore the personal innuendo from both sides.

But, if you want an informed and reasonable discussion, you must make sure that your own posts are reasonable and informed.

If you do that, then the unreasonable posts will be more obviously unreasonable and will decline in number.

But repeated references to the Bullingdon Club, etc. do not give the impression that you have the slightest interest in a reasoned debate.

You and your fellow trolls get your act together, and this site will improve.

For starters, can you give me an informed estimate of the off balance sheet Government liabilities incurred through Network Rail, Northern Rock and PFI contracts.

I estimate between £150 and £200 billion pounds which break’s Gordon’s 40% rule by a large margin.

the fact he prob will be just puts the lie to his meandering disingenuous diatribe re serious debate.

He was and is innocent. Period.

You may come to regret trying to trample roughshod over the law. Without due process people just disappear, get sent to remote prisons, get detained for ‘mental illness’. Is that the sort of society you want. One that makes the law up to suit itself?

to compete with you on current stats. As you are the one who has first hand experience of a country that is deluged in illegal emigrants and transiants and obvioously are employed in the area of stats, I would expect you have a better idea then me. But I do know that the figures in the 80s are correct as they are historic.

As to Spain my knowledge of there is only on a holiday and I was not impressed, but then it has a socialist government and, the same as UK, currently covered in plastic bags.

As to NHS. As I have family in Australia and Canada I say without a shadow of doubt that nobody that lives in either country would leave a country that has good clean hospitals and great health services to have treatment in UK.

If you look up hazel tree on wikipedia, you get an answer under the section Occultism and Parapsychology ………..

you know full well he was as guilty as hell.

I guess he is a family friend? You involved in the same charities?

If genetic evidence was appropriate and he was 40 years younger they would consider retrying him is my guess.

innocent until proven guilty.

I think it’s rather risky to consider someone guilty without them having been proven guilty in a court of law.

Consequently:
Blair is innocent of offering cash for honours (yeah, right….)
Hain is innocent of failing to register donations with the electoral commission (who are you kidding….?)
Derek Conway only claimed what he was legitimately entitled to claim as expenses (getaway!) and
Ken Dodd did not evade payment of income tax.

Thankyou.

Order! order! order!
Expenses! what are they?
Well no surprise here.
He is as slimy as he looks

"emigrants will come back here just in time to avail themselves of NHS treatment?"

The answer of course being none, because:
1) It would not be free to non-residents.
2) All but those who went to USA have cheaper health services where they are.
3) Those who managed to go to USA have skills, otherwise they would not have been able to get in. Those with skills earn so much more than those in UK that their reduction in taxes more than offsets their health insurance.
4) Emigrants have brains & are not willing to risk being in the 10,000 killed by the NHS’s infections.

if you want to be reasonable, that is a good thing.

£30bn. that is the figure bandied in the FT. you know that it is all going to appear on the balance sheet in the next year. but it is about 2%. i will cut and paste some stuff from the FT if that is what you want.

2% of GDP, or thereabouts.

now feel free to continue the discussion. i have done it with Ian B, Kaytie and certain others that are prepared to rise above the tribalism.

i disagree with ID cards. i disagreed on Iraq. I think the Gov play to the redtops on immigration and housing. i am not convinced that hosting an Olympics is a good trade – but i am open enough to be surprised. i think we are far too Eurosceptic, Government included. i am no lackey.

proceed by all means.

but don’t suggest the economy is doing other than brilliantly, that Bean is not the best chancellor ever, that house prices will not fall, that the currency is anything other than strong or that the UK the undeclared public sector liabilities equal 100% of GDP (as some other economists claim).

Other than that, proceed and acknowledge the great miracle of prudence, stability and growth that this wonderful Labour government has brought……

Doddy was so guilty it was unreal, the jury didn’t want to find him guilty and see him go to jail. Ok, but silly to pretend.

Blair is innocent of offering cash for honours, they don’t call him the Vicar for nothing, an entirely credible result.

Hain is innocent of failing to register donations with the electoral commission – dunno, admin carelessness is common among politicos, raise the money and politicos will campaign with it.

Derek Conway only claimed what he was legitimately entitled to claim as expenses – he hasn’t been charged, but his irregularities did lead to a suspension from the House. It was interesting because the Parliamentary Commissioner (or whatever the official is called) said of the first report of Conway that the extent/degree of wrongdoing was unclear.

you are too modest. that is uncharacteristic in these parts. i applaud it.

read my previous post which proves that i am not a lackey. i am, however, most certainly in favour of big Government, for reasons which i can give and back up.

that is big Government which looks after EVERYONE. not big or small government that looks after no-one or only the rich. we can discuss all that stuff, whenever you fancy.

we live in a country with serious income inequality. it would cost about £5bn to change that materially. i would spend the ID budget on that. i would not be pissing around with IHT breaks.

you can talk to me anytime you like and i will listen.

even if that complete nutter is still trying to derail every discussion with a ‘one-eyed homosexual paedophile’ rant.

for all our sakes’, post the stats that suggest that PFI is more than £30bn. please do!!

2-ish of GDP.

Hazel,

Network Rail (which is guaranteed by the Government) has debts of about £25 billion pounds.

Northern Rock (which is guaranteed by the Government) has debts of about £100 billion pounds. Some of this is balanced by claims on mortgages but if, and only if, the Government will let the managementr of Northern Rock foreclose on home owners who are (a) in arrears and (b) happen to live in Labour held seats that might be lost at the next election. Some chance.

And we don’t know the liabilities from PFI (Private Finance Initiave) because the Government will not allow the Office of National Statistics to collect the figures.

We’re in trouble here. Too much trouble for a blog posting to get us out of.

…..are all court decisions subject to confirmation by retired postmen?

Do you recall one of Labour’s heroes, the late great unlamented tub of lying lard SIR Robert Maxwell who won so many libel cases, until it was discovered that not only had he been doing what was alleged, but it was but the tip of the iceberg.

I expect you would have been a fulsome supporter of his at the time – he certainly gave Gay Gordo the ideas about how to rob the pensioners.

Luvit!

I suggest that you think hard about what James Strachan said. If you continue to insult everyone here with risible tractor numbers, liberally interspersed with your particular childish brand of class hatred – neither of which have any bearing on any of the discussions, then you will find that people like me will ridicule you and your Dear Leader until the cows come home or the chickens to roost – count on it.
I can be as reasonable as anyone – Q posted a good comment on the weasel Jack Straw, and I answered in kind. It is you, with your endless lies, and disdain for everyone else’s points of view that grate, and bring out the worst in your opponents – so the remedy is in your hands.
The constantly repeated misquotes, eg I called Bean a paedophile, Boris promised to cut police numbers, and a dozen others trotted out incessantly in the face of flat denials that show you to be the ugly face of ZaNuLab fascism.

Why don’t you start by denying that you are paid to do this. Unlike with you, we might believe you.

I am scrupulous in declaring these for tax purposes.

I wouldn’t pay Ken Dodd cash, and neither would anyone wanting to avoid trouble.

trust your unca gunsell . . .

was never proven guilty…..although his sons were, I think.

quite wrong.

When I heard about the likely fraud re the pensions, which were public knowledge in my circle before it was national, I said he wasn’t our bastard anymore, he was just a crook.

It happened in Mrs Thatcher’s time I recall, lots of crookedness gong on then I recall.

http://www.eutruth.org.uk/eu200bn.htm

I remeber one of them – the worst of the two with a wife called Pandora(!) coming out of the Knightsbridge office of one of my friend/customers. He’d gone there for help and got it, and I was disgusted and said so.

Recall Ian Hislop coming down the High Court steps having lost another libel case to the fat bully, saying "if this is justice, I’m a banana."?

Britain is very good at protecting the evildoers in high placs, which is why I like to cast as much light on the Nu-Labour hierarchy as possible for those who have simply no idea what is going on, and being done in their names. The 30 year rule, or whatever they maage to stretch things out to is always very revelatory, and it almost always turns out worse than we suspected.
Tom Driberg Labour MP – good case in point.

says that Robert Maxwell’s lifetetime of lying, thieving, and bullying was the fault of – wait for it

"It happened in Mrs Thatcher’s time I recall, lots of crookedness gong on then I recall."

Quackers, you have really lost it if you think that one is going to fly. Maxwell was up to his neck in it during the war. A little before the sainted Mrs T’s blessed tenure.
Get a grip man.

Come on out Hazel and give us some answers that are not off the Dear Leader’s instruction sheet.

And for services to what? Labour Party funds?

Come on out Hazel and give us some answers that are not off the Dear Leader’s instruction sheet.

That would be a yes, the fat crook led the way in buying honours, a ploy which has been so thoroughly developed by succeeding Labour govts.

You both appear so very silly playing gangsters here.

Why don’t you lie down and sleep it off?

Who got honours in Harold Wilson’s final honours list?

The Times wrote, in May 1976:

"One reads the roll of honour: Delfont, Grade, Kagan, Rayne, Weidenfeld, Goldsmith, Hanson, Miller, Sternberg…. Are they his friends?"

Sir Robert Maxwell (born Ján Ludvík Hoch) was at one time the Labour Party’s biggest backer. Reportedly, Maxwell ‘looted pension funds’. He is buried in a place of honour in Israel.

Whoever you are, please come home and run the country. I’m afraid you may have to take a cut in salary but think of the perks!

Great Tory treasurer & etc, fundraiser . . .

Later Lord MacAlpine.

Explain the difference – Tree is an apologist for every misstep the incompetent freakshow makes. No-one of independent mind could possibly be so in tune with such a Jonah of a politician, who remains unelected.
She continues to refuse to deny she is paid by the party – so what would you expect anybody to think?

……"When will you lot pay back the Asil Nadir shareholders"?

Which "lot" do you refer to Quacko? Did the Labour party in a moment of humility reimburse the MGN pensioners for the theft of their PENSIONS by one of the senior Labour Party figures and ex MP?

Making excuses for him, as I thought.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shirley_Porter

extract:

"Another vital part of Building Stable Communities was the removal of homeless voters and others who lived in hostels and were perceived less likely to vote Conservative, such as students and nurses, from the City of Westminster. While this initially proved successful, other Councils in London and the Home Counties soon became aware of homeless individuals and families from Westminster, many with complex mental health and addiction problems, being dumped in their area.

"As the City Council found it more and more difficult to move homeless people outside Westminster, increasingly the logic of Building Stable Communities required the concentration of homeless people within safe wards in the City.

"The most morally disturbing aspect of Building Stable Communities occurred in 1989 when over 100 homeless families were removed from hostels in marginal wards and placed in the Hermes and Chantry Point tower blocks in the safe Labour ward of Harrow Road. These blocks were riddled with the most dangerous form of asbestos, and should have either been cleaned up or demolished a decade before, but had somehow remained in place due to funding disputes between the City Council and the by now abolished Greater London Council.

"Many of the flats had had their heating and sanitation systems destroyed by the council to prevent their use as drug dens, others had indeed been taken over by heroin users and still others had pigeons making nests out of asbestos, with the level of asbestos in flats in Hermes and Chantry Points well above safe norms."

She is still evading paying what she owes London.

You sometimes agree, often on absolute crazinesses.

I suppose that proves that Trelliar employs the 45% er as a night watchman in her disused fake handbag factory . . .

as Corporal Jones would say.

There’ll be an inquest at Labour Party HQ tomorrow over this – how the spinners nodded off on the job and had to desperately post half of Wikipedia to try to make up for it.

DumbDumb asleep in the back of the shop. Tree stumped for a response. Bean’s defo on toast now!

you should ask them for some extra cash tomorrow – having to try to defend this space single-handed!

Sammy will be sad.

…says poor old Quackers, only one on shift and that nasty Mrs T and the gunsell are bullyin me – Help!

Did you read how she had to get rid of most of her fortune to avoid paying what she owes?

She sold my grandfather’s grave, no end to the depths she plumbed, not just a crook, but a disgusting crook.

You still haven’t told me whether you discus such with your son, any woman whom may have the extreme misfortune to have you in their life? (Trelliar excluded, she is a volunteer it seems)

I thought you’d have known that by now.

Speaker Martin seems to be competing for the roll of honour too – wasting £100,000 on lawyers trying to prevent us finding out what they’ve spent our cash on.

So the sale of your Grandad’s grave equates to the theft of your pension? Hmmmmm.
She also taught Labour how to gerrymander didn’t she? another lesson well learned.

Somehow Quackers try as you will you cannot elevate Porter to the same league as Maxwell for sheer vileness. Sorry.

Just pos a bit more objective and knowledgeable than you shower.

"Ah yes the paedophile and homosexual obsessed 45"

You want to go back to this topic AGAIN???

Just let me know and we can discuss the monocular freakshow’s weird predilections as much as you like – but I thought you objected to it?

Where’s the Stump, doesn’t she have to okay it for you?

crook of them all. Mr Gordon Brown stealing billions from pensioners. Then stealing from the poor by canceling the 10p tax level.

Mrs Trellis . The attachment to one of your blogs. With regard to plastic dags. If the government would pay 5p to presons bringing the bags to a collection centre then possibly they might get some of the lazy sods to get of their butts and at the same time clean the country up.

Re Ken Dodd. If he had a case with 300k in it he earned it. Three hours a night 6night a week stand up jokes. Tony Blair has more then him and his performance was nowhare as good as Doddies and he only had to do it for a couple of hours a week. He also got free holidays abroard .

If anybody is interested, I have kept our supermarket food bills (along with the rest) on Excel and I can say quite categorically that Tesco’s prices have risen between 10% -12% per annum over the last 8 years if you do the calculation by weight or volume.

"Speaker" Martin (what a misnomer for such an unintelligible oaf) left to his own devices has reverted to standard champagne socialist thievery. His attempts to conceal the details of the thievery, his and Gordon’s amongst others is a dying gasp of a fish firmly in the bottom of the boat.
The scale of their crookery may only be guessed at by this point, but it will make Conman look like a beginner.
Quackers, however assures us that all the ZaNuLab instances of law-breaking have innocent explanations. None you should note, that would cut any ice with a judge or tax inspector for the average citizen, for whom, "I forgot", or "It was my secretary/aide/sister/mother’s fault would NOT get them off the hook.

‘Speaker Martin has wasted £100,000 on lawyers trying to prevent us finding out what they’ve spent their cash on’

No wonder Brown wants to protect certain serious crimes/frauds from being investigated ‘under exceptional circumstances in cases of national interest’. Yeah right!

Can’t Doddy stand for Parliament? He’d do miles better than most of the grey-suiters.

People his ministers.

James

NR is already on the Gov books. the ONS – author of all that supposedly Government propaganda – decided that, because of restrictive covenants in the £25bn credit line the BoE extended to NR, that the Gov had effective control of it.

that is despite the fact the Government is not responsible for NR’s debt – it has not issued any guarantees, it is a shareholder only.

for that matter, neither is NR itself responsible for the bulk of the £100bn of debt because the debt was issued by the securitisation and is non-recourse to NR itself. the debt and supporting assets appear on NR’s balance sheet as linked presentation – effectively a footnote – under FRS5.

so here you have it. the £25bn guarantee of deposits was off-balance sheet as a coningent liability. the £25bn credit line was on balance sheet as a direct loan by government to NR.

but now the gov has £100bn of debt on its books that is predominantly non-recourse to NR never mind the Gov. the whole point of the securitisation is t allow investors take risk on UK mortgage assets, not mainstream corporate risk.

absurd or what?

in addition, the debt is predonimantly AAA and, so far as i know, has not been downgraded despite all the hysteria in the press. under Basle II, stuff like that receives a serious haircut in calculating capital requirements.

by my reckoning, NR adds about 7% to debt/GDP, when it should add virtually nil. in fact, as the bank has a book value of a few billion at least, you would have thought it would be good for the balance sheet.

i don’t know a great deal about that one save that it is a seriously botched privatisation.

Well Hazel,

if Northern Rock adds 7% to the debt/GDP ratio, that takes the ratio to 46% – way above Gordon’s magic number.

The debt should be "as safe as houses" because it is secured against the value of the houses that are mortgaged.

But it won’t be secure if, like Northern Rock, you lend 125% of the value of the house, or if house prices drop, or if political pressures prevent you from repossessing the house when the owner can’t pay the mortgage.

So it will be interesting to see the size of the damage when the whole mess is cleared up.

And we still have to add in the debts of Network Rail and PFI.

Northern Rock
Network Rail
Nil Return

Crock
Crack
Crunch

……..and the summing up of the ZaNuLab experience – CRAP.

There was a veritable rout on here last night, I think.

Quackers had to seek solace in a ‘lady’ : "As I now have the pleasure of a rather lovely and emntertaining lady’s company".

I didn’t know that sort of service was available in Epping Forest…..

….was what Quackers was off to keep company with I think!

Have you read today’s piece from Philip Booth (financial section)?

It’s funny how people seem to be coming round to what I was saying all along.

Especially about NR, American actions to avoid trouble and Labour’s farcical handling of the UK economy and the vulnerabulity they’ve placed us in.

started at 10pm on C4 – he was probably glued to it.
So funny.
So true.

Mrs.Trellis: ‘There was a veritable rout on here last night’
Not quite correct. I kept off this blog once I saw the degree to which some of the posting were sinking which was well below a standard that I would find acceptable. It was becoming an affront to decency.
However I am pleased to see that the more disgusting of 45govt’s postings have now been removed and I am happy , again, to have my name appear on this forum.

I am too polite, shan’t say bye or anything when these scunners are wanting company next time.

It is pretty evident that the idea of friendly relations in person with anyone of the opposite sex is either anathema or so improbable to them that 45% er cannot believe it.

I am beginning to worry that his hatred of Gordo may conceal some hideous passion. Just as well he is most prob in Bermuda with his alter id clan.

Ah! A new tv prog – "Can’t shop, can’t cook, can’t do sums!"

Q; My view with the likes of 45govt is that if you give them enough rope they will eventually hang themselves, metaphorically speaking, maybe !
And so it is proving !!
The strikes are mounting. He should now be on his best behaviour !

……don’t worry too much. You will find my loathing of the repulsive creature who masquerades as PM is matched by millions of people, who will see his monocular, visionless, vaahlewless unelected freakshow off in to the sunset when election time comes.

Bean’s on toast soon, Mrs T.

Q: You see what I mean. Better behaved already !!

David, you could not have penned an apter description of the Gorgon – an affront to decency he is, and shall henceforth be known!
Thank you!

I try not to take a personal dislike to politicians.

However, I do sympathise with your loathing.
I will never forgive this corrupt Labour bunch for what they’ve done to our country.

Another thing, I hate censorship in all its forms.

Under Labour we’ve seen an increasing amount of state control and observation, together with the removal of our ability to speak freely within a true democracy.

I find it distasteful for anyone to complain about the comment contributions on this blog, providing they don’t infringe the standards of common decency in operation before this Labour regime began their dictatorship.

laughable to suggest censorship when the Dilly Telegraph allows such perverse scunners to say anything they like.

I wondered if you were referring to Shameless Seumais, 45% ers blood brother, but it turns out there is a prog.

Had i known about it and wanted to watch it I would have called it up onto the right hand screen and continued pointing out your mate Dame Shirley’s disgrace.

prob on the left.

So don’t complain about a lack of censorship.

Personally, I’d chop out every repetition of a point that had been made a dozen times over on every blog, which would include:
DumbDumb’s IHT stupid claims
Treestump’s GDP growth irrelevance
Q’s Boris Johnson illegal phone bug transcript
Bullingdon / Piers Gaveston etc. etc.

Of course, Bean’s on toast is fine because it’s witty, as is ‘fiddler’s elbow’ and the famous ‘grin’.

There you go – I’ve lit the blue touch paper……..

You are completely out of touch.

Oh, yeah, I guess we knew that already, really…..

And he couldn’t do a worse job than the current incumbent.

Maybe offer him some tax-free perks, too – that might appeal?

of the expressions that 45govt has used and directed at some politicians,mainly…… because I cannot spell most of the words he uses……, nor can I say that any of the language that has been used by Mrs Trellis,45govt or the bloggers in general has been offensive by being directed at the ‘Three Stooges’ the opposite cannot be said in general about the three supports of the current government.

thanks for your encouragement.

I meant to ask you – did you say somewhere you were British Canadian? Do you live in Canada?

wih respect James, we can both sit and speculate.

you are absolutely right that a portfolio of 125% LTV homeloans is not as good a bet as a pool of 75% LTV. however, 3 things.

- in all likelihood, there are very few of these in the pool. no, i don’t have the figures but the NR website advertising the loan stipulated "Together Flexible Fixed rate mortgages available from 5.75% (up to 95% secured LTV with an unsecured loan of up to 30% LTV, ***subject to a maximum £30,000***)." this means that on the average home worth £200k, the most you can borrow is 110%. on a 300k home, it becomes 105%. still hardly ideal, but a long way away from 125%. the £30,000 upper limits means that this is a somewhat misleading marketing gimmick.

- second, you must be aware that credit card companies routinely securitise their accounts receivable. MBNA, even BarclayCard, tonnes of their stuff in in securitisations. that is genuine completely unsecured debt. at best, it is used for the same purpose as the £30,000 uplift granted by NR – to pay stamp duty, moving costs etc. most likely it is just unsecured credit not directed towards bricks and mortar.

- thirdly, none of us know the underwriting criteria used by the banks when doling this stuff out. do you know the precise income multiple that they would have sought, of the extent to which they verified income and he other parameters that typically identify a good credit, including credit score? i don’t.

the reality is that all this stuff will be known to Goldman, who did the due diligence and advised the government. the other potential buyers would also have been through the portfolio looking for problems. all the banks were offfering this stuff, too, meaning that 20% of it is on HBOS’ books, 9% with the Abbey, and 8% on NR’s and Lloyds’. those are the 2006 market share numbers for UK residential mortgage lending – assuming they are broadly equivalent through the time period the product was on offer.

finally, s i have said before, ‘if’ these products are in the securitisation, risk will have passed to investors. who knows, bar Goldman, the Government, Virgin et al.

what is remarkabl about NR is the way in which the BoE dalt with the moral hazard. JPM take all the uplift in Bear, and are currently rewarding shareholders for failure. as i recall, NR shareholders got not a penny, and the UK taxpayer gets all the uplift. the BoE is lending un punitive terms, unlike the Fed.

it would also be wrong to compare the US and the UK too closely. the US have a negative savings ratio, the UK positive – about 4%. the US market was a true bubble, the UK market is driven by a lack of supply at the bottom end and a gradual decrease in interest rates since the ‘80, causing lenders to increase income multiples on affordability concerns.

the US is in meltdown, the UK is just stalling.

i suggest we wait and see. i will not be remotely surprised if this doesn’t turn out to be a nice little earner for the tax payer. we will hopefully see in time for an election.

see what i say about moral hazard in my previous post.

….and Hazelnuts doesn’t seem to get it that NO-ONE is interested in her false numbers game – give it a rest.
"nice little earner for the taxpayer"!!!!!!!! Come ON Hazel, even you can not believe that.

You are in the same financial expertise league as "I’m not an accountant" McBean, that well known affront to decency.*

*Copyright DDee

however, as I said I am British, That is said in the old sense. Being British is different from being a Briton or a Scot or Welshman. It is a view and ideas that have stood the UK in good standing for years.

I don’t really care which political party is in power in UK. It usually irons out after the wash. I do care when I see 1000 years of development being washed down the plug by both parties.

Yes I’m Canadian and proud of it,but my family is spread all over the world, but they are still British.

PS. Yes I live in Canada and the ironic thing is my federal MP’s name is……. Gordon Brown., but he is a Con!!!!!!!

What a co-incidence, Goron Brown is our PM as you know, and he too is a con!

Firstly, go here:http://www.uksa.org.uk/NorthernRock.htm

It’s clear the action is far from over on the shareholders, but if, as Tree seems to delight in telling us, there is shedloads of value – billions she claims, in the Rock, then she is delighting in the theft of that value from the shareholders – just like when Labour shafted the little old ladies whose pension money was invested in Railtrack shares.

But that’s Labour for you – trample on the little man and woman – ignore property rights.

As for the ‘moral hazard’ argument, that’s out the window. Just because the BoE is arriving late at the party (and is only now starting to shovel money into the market in return for poor collateral) certainly doesn’t mean it has a higher moral ‘high ground’ than the Fed. What’s going on here is a desperate attempt to prevent systemic failure of the global financial systems. ‘Moral Hazard’? What planet are you on?

And you conveniently forget to mention that a private sector solution wasn’t possible because of the complete mess Bean made of BoE independence – he set up an unworkable tripartite arrangement that fell apart the first time it came under stress. The FSA has just ‘coughed’ to being utterly useless at bank monitoring.

So if Bear Stearns had have been based in London, another great tanche of taxpayers money would have had to have been committed to bailing out yet another bank.

Face it, Tree, your man Bean has screwed up big time.

I keep thinking of coming over to Canada – I really should get on and do it! Where do you recommend looking?

"the US [housing] market was a true bubble, the UK market is driven by a lack of supply at the bottom end"

OECD House Price Ratios (longterm norm = 100): (Latest available figures (2006)
Price to rent ratio: USA 134.8 UK 164.3
Price to income ratio: USA 116.6 UK 140.1

So the UK is massively overpriced on both measures.

The house price to incomes ratio in the UK has gone up by 40% since 2001. No wonder people can’t afford to buy any more. No wonder people feel poorer. No wonder there’s a house price crash coming.

But Tree will carry on right to the bitter end trying to tell you that black is white and white is black.

She has to – it’s what she’s paid to do. Facts don’t come into her equation, unless she can find some that accidentally fit the narrative she wants to bamboozle with, increasingly unlikely nowadays.
Bad news is coming down the pike, and it has Bean, that affront to decency’s* fingerprints all over it. There is nothing the Stump can do to convince people that the earth is flat – she is simply out of time.

*Copyright DDee

are really going for the Cashcroft gold today.

Pretty clear who regards this as a full time occupation . . .

Depends on your teasts. The Big Sky Lots of Room(LOR) British ideas .Ontario .
Touch of Europe quite Frnch, good sense of humour, Quebec(LOR)

The sea. Nova Scotia, New Brunswick .Newfoundland, Speak with a funny accent. Irish /Cornish in ‘Nufie’(LOR)

If you like tea and crumpets Vitoria BC on Vancouver Island.

Big mountains BC generally. Learn to say ‘You Bet’ for ‘Yes’ Chinese food and lots of sking (LOR)

Aberta. Very American in cowboy boots. Big Hats and bolos.

One thing that is very true is the the definition of a Canadian

An Americn walks down the street as if he owns it. A Canadian walks down the street and does not care who owns it.

One think you find wherever you go you will be treated in courteous manner (they wont your trade) and a friendly attitude.

Sterling dealing box in one corner of the screen, blog in the other.

Sell some sterling, wait for another of the many and frequent downward legs and take the profit. Meantime I see it as a sort of civic duty to correct the many misleading statements put out with the Tractor Production statistics by the Treestump. Can’t have people going round believing that guff, can we?

Go to BC, the islands are beautiful, you can go up North for spectacular scenery, and drive down to Seattle as an excursion.
Added bonus, it’s a LONG way from McBean!

everytime you rattle the bucket like this, i feel you are trying to suppress a debate, or be the loudest at shouting. i was merely asnwering a very specific point made by James.

for the record, NR is probably (definitely, IMHO) a nice little earner for us, the taxpayers. market conditions – esp the lack of capital – meant it had a ‘market value’ of zero, yet a ‘book value’ of c£2.5bn.

that c£2.5bn windfall is on top of the fees and the punitive backstop rate the BoE is charging.

in addition, the BoE has made it clear – unlike the Fed – that failure is not going to be rewarded by the taxpayer. we now know that the Fed will bail out EVERY bank in the US. i doubt very seriously the BoE will touch any institution with a dodgy balance sheet.

as i say, let’s wait and see. the good news should come before an election.

…and stop being so aggressive. where does it get you?

If NR has a ‘book value’ of £2.5 bn there is absolutely no way it has a market value of zero.

Which school of business did you get your GCSE home economics from?

Agreesive? Moi? Anyone (apart from the paid Trolls) want to second that motion?

"that failure is not going to be rewarded by the taxpayer".
Don’t be ridiculous – it already has, and only because it is ZaNuLab heartland.
Truly, the earth is NOT flat.

Trells

I have explained this many times but here we gog again.

Average rates in the ’80’s were 12%. on a 200k house, that’s 24k pa or 2k pcm.

rates now are say 6% (the’ve actually been lower). the mortgage costs 12k pa or 1k pcm.

the cost of buying a house has halved, meaning that, in a market blighted by lack of supply, prices should more than double without negatively impacting affordability at any rung in the ladder. meaning also that lenders use a different income multiple reflecting new affordability. 5 the new 2.5.

the transition from 12% to 5% has been gradual, and the market has re-priced gradually. look at the BBA’s accont of base rates going back to Thatcher nd you will see this all happen.

the problem you will find with using rental rates to price properties is that there is an oversupply of rented accommodation in the market, meaning that BTL investors struggled to justify their investment on a pur cashflow basis. (BTL have also added to HPI.)

the best way to make BTL work is at the real bottom end – a few of my pals do that, letting to Aussie backpackers etc.

do it with a 4 bed house and you will strugle to make it work. therefore, thay are dependent upon capital appreciation.

real UK GDP has grown the fastest amongst the G7, as the same OECD (and IMF) websites will show you. one of the ways to measure GDP is to measure real incomes. arguing that real incomes have fallen during Labour is fallacious. there is no need to deliberately mislead people. if your arguments are good, the data will support them.

It is simply the ZaNuLab playbook – attack is the best form of defence and in direct inverse proportion to the validity of the defence.

Bean’s on toast soon!

"If NR has a ‘book value’ of £2.5 bn there is absolutely no way it has a market value of zero."

This is exactly what happened. And I was careful to include an explanation – a global shortage of capital. Basic supply and demand, as it happens. Plus a whole load of fear, as Greenspan has mentioned.

No-one would have touched it without serious Government support. Trading had been suspended. No willing buyer = no market value. Period.

Net book value = c£2.5bn.

you’re at it again. cheering each other on. do you think people are stupid enough to fall for it.

read the posts and criticise what is said, if you can. but please don’t expect much of a response to the mere rhetoric of cheerleading.

the bottom line is that time will tell. my bet is that this is a nice little £2.5bn+ earner for the tax payer – with no reward to a failed bank. we shall see.

You simply go on repeating the same canard, "real UK GDP has grown the fastest amongst the G7". This is nonsense, in the same league as inflation at 2.8% – not even remotely true. Any GDP "growth" is simply based on debt, and less than worthless.
You must get out into the real world more.

" the market has re-priced gradually". Really – where?

"there is no need to deliberately mislead people. if your arguments are good, the data will support them"

Well we can agree with that, but your tractor production numbers support nothing, and your arguments risible – they are are simply the superlative of the noun "lie".

Bean’s on toast soon.

Try and tell that one to the City. LOL.

Horseman: ‘nor can I say that any of the language that has been used by Mrs Trellis,45govt or the bloggers in general has been offensive by being directed at the ‘Three Stooges’ the opposite cannot be said in general about the three supports of the current government’
I do not understand this. Could you offer some clarification ?
Regarding being offensive. Certain comments made by 45govt on this blog really were an affront to the decency of any normal person. Unfortunately (or fortunately ?) I cannot refer you to them because they were so offensive that they have been removed and as 45govt has, I suspect being warned as to his future behaviour, they are unlikely to appear again.

"No reward to a failed bank": how much did the execs get paid?

NBV = c£2.5bn – even a fire sale would have realised at least half of that if the mortgage book is as good as you say. And if there was no capital to buy Crock, how come Bear Sterns is getting bought by JPM???????

If it’s a ‘nice little earner for the taxpayer’ what do you say to all the small investors who’ve lost their pension investment?

Don’t tempt me. They can be found at a website whose address anyone may have, together with similar revelations about that affront to decency* masquerading as PM, McBean.

*Copyright DDee

Her argument: houses have repriced because interest rates have fallen from av. 12% in 1980s to 5% today.

My argument based on OECD stats: House price to income ratio went up 40% between 2001 and 2006. If incomes didn’t fall (I’ll go along with Tree’s claim that they haven’t for now) then house prices have indeed risen by more than 40% in five years, and it has absolutely nothing to do with interest rates in the 1980s. There has been a housing bubble here just as there has been one in USA.

i don’t need to. it was recorded in the FT financials for NR at the time. in fact they might have cited £4bn. i am using a conservative estimate.

bearing in mind that they hold equity capital of 50%*10% = 5% under Basle, the book value to the Gov should be c£5bn. do the sums and leave off the cheerleading. you will see that this provides a pretty accurate prediction.

do the sums Trells.

even if income is static, if rates halve, then affordability doubles. prices should therefore double due to supply and demand.

do some sums and you will see.

"the US [housing] market was a true bubble, the UK market is driven by a lack of supply at the bottom end"

I don’t deny that capital values are affected by interest rates: the ‘yield’ from rent and how that compares with interest rates generally in the market is what largely determines the value of property.

But you were trying to say that USA had a housing bubble but we haven’t. I have pointed out that the 40% rise in UK house prices (as a ratio to incomes)between 2001 and 2006 is also a bubble – and one which will and is bursting.

Even if I accept your argument that it was driven by lack of supply at the bottom end (it wasn’t) it’s your mate Bean’s fault for allowing massive immigration and a schlerotic planning system.

Check mate.

I thought it was QZ, Tree and DD that participated in that particular variant of mutual whatever.

Nope, not me. Have they copyrighted that as well as the PhrasesULiketoHate?

"Borrowers hit after UK’s second-largest lender raises tracker rates by 0.57 per cent to as much as 7.1 per cent to deter business" The Times, today.

Strange that – I thought she said interest rates were now averaging 5% and houses had repriced because they were so much more affordable. Looks like negative equity territory to me…..

Was that a couple of plates I heard crashing there…..?

……or you will encourage the Stump to go and ferret out more tractor details. I don’t know that I could stand it it!

Trells

i told you that even if incomes were static, it is the percentage of income taken up by mortgage interest that matters. if it used to take up 50% of my income, yet now only takes 25%, then i can afford a mortgage that is twice as big.

i gave you the numbers above for the average property in ‘08 real prices, valued at 200k, mortgage payment now 1 pcm, was under old rates 2k pcm. monthly mortgage bill halved.

that means prices will double under very simple and straightforward supply and demand principles.

i am saddened, and consider it somewhat beneath you, that you should play the immigration card on this one BTW.

what i have noticed is that you, Phil and the other immigration-centric types, are happy to argue that immigrants dodge Council TAx by stuffing 20 people into a house, yet here you are arguing that they are all contributing to demand for housing. which one is it?

the truth is that people are living in smaller units for various reasons. divorce is a biggie. not settling down in the first place with a partner. more and more people leaving procreation until the 40’s.

but, once again, the US bubble is a bubble precisely because they actually had more supply than demand last time i checked, yet prices kept rising. this was fuelled by NINJA loans. something like 30% of the mortgage market is true subprime.

in the UK, there is a c3% much more conservative subprime market.

as with NR and the £2.5bn+ windfall to tax payers, i suggest we wait and see. the froth will be well off the UK housing merket by then.

showing off her French oral skills.

Bean apparently tried to do the same today, but quickly reverted to his tried and tested grin – you know the one I mean -

btw, did they really get some comments taken down – I didn’t notice any missing?

Yes, I posted a VERY scurrilous but hilarious piece written by a friend of a spoof McCain inauguration speech explaining to "my fellow Murkins" why he would never set foot in Englandistan again. I even expurgated it for them, but it only lasted about 15 mins!!
Unlike other blogs, which leave a "this comment has been removed by blog administrator", there is no evidence of the expungement (if there is such a word) on these.

"that immigrants dodge Council TAx by stuffing 20 people into a house" although it is undoubtedly true that there are plenty of horrific overcrowding stories around.

I employed a couple of Polish students last year and the year before, and they were living in appalling conditions in a house of over a dozen Polish gypsies.

Mrs. Trellis: ‘did they really get some comments taken down – I didn’t notice any missing?’

Gosh, such innocence !!
As 45Govt is easily led and as his participation on this forum is now dependent upon his good behaviour, can I suggest, again, that you desist from encouraging him. We wouldn’t want to miss his informative and illustrative postings, would we ?

"as his participation on this forum is now dependent upon his good behaviour"

Who says? The post was only up for a few minutes, so Mrs Trellis must have missed the glory of it, and so must many others. I take it that you were able to enjoy it to the full though. Good-o.
There is plenty more where that came from, a whole book full of pertinent (yes scurrilous) and accurate observations on that affront to decency* masquerading as PM, one Jonah McBean.

*Copyright DDee

I thought the Gorgon’s middle name was Shylock?

Mrs. Trellis: Tsk, tsk, No encouragement, remember.

First I was ‘grooming’ mattsta

Now I am leading an ‘easily led’ 45govt.

Hmmmm – I think they are both very capable of saying what they think. However, if you were to listen and learn and perhaps follow these very inventive, entertaining and informative comment-posters, you could find happiness and fellowship, truth and light….

"Gordon Brown has all but written off Ken Livingstone

this is game set and match on the mature side of thimgs.

please, you ought to scroll up.

i know you run a knicker factory, but sterling’s dancing all over the shop is commonplace.

i have made a huge number of substantive points about the Uk economy, esp the housing market, upon which your pour derision yet nothing even approaching a serious point of view.

what i have noticed is that you, Phil and the other immigration-centric types, are happy to argue that immigrants dodge Council TAx by stuffing 20 people into a house, yet here you are arguing that they are all contributing to demand for housing. which one is it?

the truth is that people are living in smaller units for various reasons. divorce is a biggie. not settling down in the first place with a partner. more and more people leaving procreation until the 40’s.

but, once again, the US bubble is a bubble precisely because they actually had more supply than demand last time i checked, yet prices kept rising. this was fuelled by NINJA loans. something like 30% of the mortgage market is true subprime.

for the record, NR is probably (definitely, IMHO) a nice little earner for us, the taxpayers. market conditions – esp the lack of capital – meant it had a ‘market value’ of zero, yet a ‘book value’ of c£2.5bn.

that c£2.5bn windfall is on top of the fees and the punitive backstop rate the BoE is charging.

in addition, the BoE has made it clear – unlike the Fed – that failure is not going to be rewarded by the taxpayer. we now know that the Fed will bail out EVERY bank in the US. i doubt very seriously the BoE will touch any institution with a dodgy balance sheet.

as i say, let’s wait and see. the good news should come before an election.

Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

As requested:-

http://aplumberslogic.blogspot.com/

As a school teacher you will be well used to foul language from the little darlings of ZaNuLab’s edukatshunnle experiment, but be warned – there is very foul language, and concepts here (I expurgated the piece the Tel so swiftly removed), but used by a master craftman in the use of English, and in the understanding of the vilest excesses of the Establishment.

The piece in question is "An extract from President McCain’s prepared inauguration speech". Enjoy.

Phil = Immigration centric types? So, we’re down in the gutter again eh?

I’ve nothing against managed immigration.
Immigration that’s controlled, required and can be accomodated.
Much the same as this Labour regime are now boasting will be their policy.

Of course, its coming up to election time, so as usual, Labour make all the noises they think will get them re-elected for yet another disastrous term.
Like all announcements of intent to control Labour’s immigration free-for-all, its just lies and spin, nothing changes.

As for immigrants putting pressure on Britain’s limited housing stock, well, that’s a fact, and the reason why this Labour regime are wanting to cover the land with ugly, low grade, neighbour unfriendly housing estates.

I’ve never argued a line on dodging our sky high council taxes.
However, British families are being pushed to the back of the council and association queues so that immigrants can be housed as a priority.

Also, and I have less objection to this, immigrants from the better regarded & harder working countries, ie, Poland, Slovakia, are wanting to live here and are buying houses for that purpose.

I object to being completely unable to control, or manage British immigration policy due to a foreign quango telling us that we must allow it.
Of course, it suits Labour down to the ground.

Anyway, I hope you read the article that I spoke of today.
Going back a few months, I think I was the only one who was questioning the rescue of NR, and UK/U.S. response to the financial crises.
As time goes on, more and more people are warning of the dangers of such interventions and giving their reason why.

The obvious thing out of all of this is that Labour’s hand was forced to cover their own incompetence.
Also, because eleven years of Labour mismanagement has made our economy vulnerable to collapse, Gordon is being forced to jump through hoops in order to try to paper over the cracks.

The thing I hate is all the insulting propaganda he’s currently being allowed to get away with at the moment.
Each question turns into electioneering and blame shifting.
Of course, it pains the likes of us who know he’s playing to a wider audience, even if we can see the sweat rolling off that nervous brow.

.

….and the chewed fingernails, and the jaw dropping like a fiddler’s elbow!

Bean’s on toast!

Indeed, and soon!

With grateful acknowledgement to Mrs Trellis.

If Labour manage to con the public and scrape through to another disastrous win, I may be joining you over there in BC or Ontario.

Britain won’t stand another term of Labour mismanagement and incompetence.

I’m just wondering if Ladbrokes are running a book on which country will collapse through mismanagement first, Britain or Zimbabwe.

A close run thing I think, with incapability Brown doing his hardest to run us into the ground.

.

There is surely enough reason now to register a nationwide no-confidence vote in this government, the worst one surely, Britain has ever had in terms of destroying the Establishment?
How does one go about overthrowing the government in a peaceful a fashion as possible, before New labour does any more damage with its traiterous and irreversible ‘reforms’?

You’re repeating yourself now. That last diatribe was almost verbatim what you had put up earlier. DO you not comprehend any other arguments or is it just that you will not countenance any view than your own?

1. "i know you run a knicker factory" I do not run a knicker factory

2. "sterling’s dancing all over the shop is commonplace" Many currency pairs are volatile, but a sustained slide of 20%+ is not ‘dancing all over the place’ – it’s a devaluation based on weak fundamentals in the economy.

3. "i have made a huge number of substantive points" sorry, you have made very few ’substantive’ points – ‘biggest GDP growth in the G7 over the last ten years’ is one of a tiny handful you have made – repeatedly.

4. "you, Phil and the other immigration-centric types" – pretty well most of the UK indigenous population I think you’ll find!

5. "are happy to argue that immigrants dodge Council TAx " – no I have never, ever argued or even mentioned that.

6. "the truth is that people are living in smaller units" – what’s that got to do with the housing bubble? Oh, yeah – it’s because they cannot afford to live in a normal sized house now, so they have to pick up one of these over-priced shoe-box size conversions that have made developers rich.

7. "US bubble is a bubble precisely because they actually had more supply than demand" – so if we have such a shortage of supply in the UK, explain why the housing market has suddenly stopped dead in its tracks. Why are upwards of 50% of new city centre developments in the North of England sitting empty?

8. "NR is probably (definitely, IMHO) a nice little earner for us" – answer my point about all the small investors who have lost their pension thanks to HMG taking the shares off them for nothing

9. "[NR] had a ‘market value’ of zero, yet a ‘book value’ of c£2.5bn." – I say that’s b*ll*cks, but answer my point then about why Bear Sterns could be rescued by another bank but NR could not.

10. "that c£2.5bn windfall" – it is not a windfall – it is the (mis)appropriation of the shareholder’s investment in the business.

11. "we now know that the Fed will bail out EVERY bank in the US. i doubt very seriously the BoE will touch any institution with a dodgy balance sheet" – the BoE is behind the curve – it is grudgingly and belatedly accepting that it either helps save the international finance system or it watches the entire banking sector go t*ts up. King has had to do one U-turn after another since last August.

12. "good news should come before an election" – good news will come after an election, and the sooner the better.

And finally, DO NOT SAY AGAIN "upon which your pour derision yet nothing even approaching a serious point of view". I continually make serious points as well you know.

How do you fancy Bean’s on toast? MMMmmmm lovely!

Nice work.

Now THIS Hazel is cheering MrsT on.

Neither Trelliar nor the 45% er shows any sign of a surviving live in partner, relative, housekeeper even . . .

There are more and more smaller household units and correspondingly demand for more and smaller accommodation.

Just the most glaringly obvious Trenonesense, no time to pick all the holes the knicker and fake handbag factory closer and her creature endorse this time.

Iceland was in difficulties, lots have been.

Wanna bet re the UK and Zimbabwe economies?

The UK is looking good and you cannot stand it.

They are still building in London, and asking prices are still high, heaven knows there will be reductions, but professional opinion is that overall reductions will be very manageable.

As you and others have been claiming to want lower prices so people can get on the housing ladder a trifle dissembling here I think . . .

Pity the USA now has one fewer.

Competition, dear lady, competition . . .

Thanks for the link – I saw this the other night – maybe you posted it before – it is very, very funny, cheers!

About £600 return on Zoom airlines – and that’s on the Premier Plus tariff booked in advance.

I really must do it.

You want a sign?

What kind of a sign would you like.

A red light? Like the one you were entertaining last night?

It’s unrestrained unmonitored reckless competition that got the Crock into trouble in the first place!

There’s still 250+ building societies let anyway. And John Charcol were saying last week that there were 11,000 (yes thousand) different mortgage products on the market.

Of course they are. People can ask what they want.

But whether anyone can get loans to buy at the ‘asking prices’ is growing ever more doubtful.

people have bid up the price of houses based on the reduced interest rates of recent years.

It is not a simple function of income as she suggests.

Rents likewise have risen in London because of increased demand.

Sorry for the delay in answering your blog. I’m learning to play Bridge. I’m using a book that Ken Dodd wrote for his Diddy people.

I will say it again. I have never read any comment by Mrs Trellis or 45 govt that has been directed at any of the ‘Three Stooges. personally.
I have seen some remarks that 45 govt has directed at politicians which I would not use, but then I am a gentle creature like a horse. Hence the AKA.

have the temperament for human relations.

Dunno how Trelliar thinks I can afford a tart, she must live in a different world i guess.

I can afford the occasional taxi fare though.

With her limited culinary expertise I guess she eats out all the time too . . .

How did she enjoy the toasting Macaroon was subjected to?

No wonder he was a "special advisor" carrying Lamont’s bag on Black wednesday, while Ed Balls was an "Economic Advisor."

Can’t see any Labour Minister employing Osbourne in either capacity, can you?

Interesting that Alan Duncan has been given the occasional run out in the media recently . .

you must be in a very divergent universe to the rest of us.

The paedophile and homosexual obsessed loon has made a habit of calling Dave dumb & etc.

No justification for this insult, while most of the names he takes exception to are well founded in his online behaviour.

He has repeatedly raised homosexuality and paedophilia on threads which have no relation to these topics, usually to try and smear HMG.

Trelliar supports his perverse fits.

Kindly pay attention!

You’re rambing nonsensically again, dear.

You really shouldn’t comment on these lengthy blogs – you’ve forgotten what was written earlier and now you’ve made a bit of a fool of yourself by making up things you think I might have said instead of following what I actually said.

Macaroon’s toasting? You refering to PMQs? On Wednesday, when Bean continually avoided answering a simple question (as usual) and then read out a pre-prepared attempt at a put down at the end when Cameron could not reply? Not clever really, is it? Does Bean think he is getting away with these tactics? If he does, you’d better let him know that we are all watchin him and clocking his inability to answer any question DC puts to him. If he thinks answering a question with a question is clever, remind him that is just playground banter, not statesman-like leadership. It just makes him look like a student union wimp.

so off blog, and so far out of contact with reality.

Poor Macaroon cannot do economics, neither can Osbourne, nor can she.

That is why Macaroon was sooo very toastie.

to bring you a little closer to speed:

lampoon
verb
she was mercilessly lampooned satirize, mock, ridicule, make fun of, caricature, burlesque, parody, tease; informal roast, send up.

As Macaroon claims to be the heir to Blair perhaps he should look to Tony Blair for advice?

Cos Gordo and Tony both have it over the macaroon, don’t they?

Unprecedented growth in our economy, a sound basis for weathering the world wide economic storms, and almost no opposition since Hague quit.

That’s clever coming from a supporter of instability Brown and his gay divorcee Prudence – you remember Pru – the one who ran off with a bigger slice of the pudding than even Heather Mills could manage……

I obviously think I in a better country. I’m to so sure about a different universe.

your example is weak. ‘Dumb Dumb’ is quite acceptable in my book. It is not offensive. My name for him is ‘Canterbury Kid’ now I have found out how to spell ‘Canterbury’ I have no objection to being called ‘Horsey,’also I think ‘Hazel Nut Tree’ is acceptable. She appears good at numbers, but her history knowledge is very lacking.

I keep telling you that my memory is excallent. I even remember sitting in my pram as a baby and wondering why my mother made me wear the rubber pants that made you sweat like hell.

Mrs Trellis you are right on with 600 UK pound. That is including tax in Canada. I don’t have a pound key on my key board. Your guess is as good as mine as to the reason.

I think "Dumb dumb" is a bit much myself, he isn’t, that simple.

I am glad you don’t object to "horsey" – horseman implies a sort of mastery of the exercise here, and, with slightly growing respect, you haven’t got that yet imho.

I chose my id carefully, I don’t intend to be entirely serious all the time, and all this can become a bit too precious perhaps?

Thus, most especially, claims that Labour are spending their pennies on an investment banker (Mrs Tree) to debate with the tories et al here is the sort of lunacy which could only appeal to a disturbed clown or a paranoid fool.

It is more credible that some of your side receive support, not least because Lord Ashcroft has billions, and was the largest ever political donor to an Australian Party (The Losing National Liberals last time).

I find that very difficult to believe – her economics is so far off beam, even allowing for some partisan bias.

So off to open the 3 for £10 stuff and celebrate!

Cheers!

Hazel and Henry Cave Devine both speak the same language, and she certainly at least matched his expertise, pretty clear she excelled in comparison.

They had common banking/stockbroking experiences in the USA it appeared when they exchanged views here on one occasion.

Good night.

If the tree is an investment banker she probably worked for Bear Stearn which would explain a lot. The every thing is fine, new paradigm, etc.

what you are talking about. Horsemanship is a never ending exercise. You don’t ride horse you talk to it.

As to Lord Ashcroft making contributions to a political party in Australia. I would suggest you inform the Australian police. They take a dim view of outside interferance with their countries politics.

Possibly that is why Doddie had a case full of lolly. On his way to Aussie possibly
.

Mrs. Trellis: Here is one that you will enjoy:

The number of business people who think the Tory candidate is seen as "too much of a buffoon" has risen from 53 to 65 per cent since January, while the proportion who believe he does not come across as serious enough has also increased, from 57 to 63 per cent. The number of business people who think he has a clearly defined set of policies has dropped from 33 to 30 per cent over the same period.

Perhaps as a result of these concerns, 69 per cent of those polled expect Mr Livingstone to win the election on 1 May, with 28 per cent predicting Mr Johnson will become Mayor and only 2 per cent forecasting a Liberal Democrat victory.

Mrs. Trellis: ‘I saw this the other night – maybe you posted it before’
45Govt repeating something, I say 45govt repeating something.
Well I never, Well I never.

and dumber and dumber

Australian politics

Lord Ashcroft has become a significant figure in Australian politics having been identified as the single largest individual donor to any Australian political party during the Financial Year 2004/2005.

The Australian Electoral Commission reported in February 2006 that Ashcroft (who gave his address as "House of Lords, Westminster, London") had donated $1,000,000 to the Liberal Party in September 2004 just before the 2004 Federal election.

It was the biggest single disclosed private donation in Australian political history.[4]

[edit]U.S. DEA leak scandal

In the U.S., an intelligence research specialist for the Drug Enforcement Administration, Jonathan Randel, leaked Ashcroft’s name as being in the DEA’s files, although it later emerged that Ashcroft was one of 5 million people they routinely had files on.

Randel claims to have believed the DEA was ignoring Ashcroft in its investigation of money laundering, so Ashcroft sued. A U.S. attorney investigated Randel for his leak.

On January 9, 2003, Randel was sentenced to a year in a federal prison, followed by three years probation.

as I suggested the term horseman suggests some mastery of the horse, you ain’t cutting it, compliment withdrawn . . .

as you drop your arguments one by one – to tiresomely bring them up again next time we cover this stuff – i will confine myself to one point i have not answered yet.

as you should but don’t know, the capital that is being used in the US to reward failed bank Bear Stearns is coming from the tax payer via seriously dodgy Fed repo’s mortgage backed securities proffered by JPM, exactly the kind of debt that brought Bear to its knees in the first place. the tax payer is the fallguy in the US. the tax payer is lending against the type of debt that ruined failed bank Bear Stearns in order to subsidise shareholders. you couldn’t make it up.

in the UK, shareholders in failed NR got nil. the Gov gets all the upside. this is the way it ought to be. the small shareholders that you mention investd in a failed bank that was mismanaged by its own management. do you want to raise taxes to subsidise people who invest in failed businesses? thought not.

NR is indeed a nice little earner. the £2.5bn is a conservative estimate. it could easily be worth twice that on asset value. of course, the market thought it was worth nil because there ws no willing buyer. that is is the basis upon which Parliament nationalised it for nil.

i hope you knicker factory has someone other than you in charge of the numbers. you too could soon be in need of a Fed bail out – presumably you could repo a prize pile of knickers as collateral!!

isn’t it strange how all the hoo-hah about NR’s mortgage book has gone away. it’s all wrapping chips now. shouldn’t people like Iain Martin, the harbingers of doom and gloom, the riders of the Apocalypse, not be complimenting HMG on a shrewd bit uf business, upwards of £2.5bn added to Treasury coffers?

i think so. we’ll see.

i am not going to get involved, BTW, in all the other tosh you posted. it is seriously gutteral. you ought to be careful about whom you befriend too. i have noticed that the quality of your posting has seriously deteriorated since you began your ‘friendship’ with 45govt – and you seem to have lost some fo your dignity. mid life crisis?

let’s face it. the immigration stuff is central to your politics. why then do you cheerlead for the Tories? they accept, as all the parties bar UKIP/BNP, that the UK needs to swell its 20-30yr old population in the short term and its kid cohort in the longer term. David Cameron knows that as well as i do. why would you vote from him? for that matter, i have never understood your politics. you espouse the policies of UKIP/BNP (no offence intended, BTW), yet you cheerlead for the Tories. NO tax cuts are on the Tory menu Phil – until 2015 at the earliest.

Not quite right my friend.

The UK is NOT doing well, but, it ‘appears’ as though it’s not doing as badly as some others.

That’s the tragedy in all this, our real and true circumstances are quite dire.
EU/Labour have made Britain a very hard place to do business.

Labour’s pre-ocupation with introducing regulation and high cost employment conditions will gradually reduce business investment and force ever more jobs overseas to Asia.

Labour have destroyed our education system.
Universities are a joke, with falling standards, record ‘drop-out’ rates, ‘dumbed down’ A-Levels, Labour’s university charges and illiterate school leavers.

Personal debt is the highest in the world.
Labour’s encouragement of profligate spending on credit cards, loans and remortgaging has kept our dodgy economy afloat and earned money for Gordon to throw down the toilet.

However, this is forcing many into self inflicted bankrupcy and home repossession.

Labour’s uncontrolled immigration is completely unsustainable, and will keep forcing up Labour’s record sky high council taxes as councils and police struggle to cope.

Gun and knife crime has become a way of life due to Labour’s dismantling of the controls which kept illegal guns and criminals out of the country.

Prisons are overflowing, with judges criticised for imprisonning people one minute, and obeying Labour’s demands not to or to release them early the next.
Police are never seen on the beat, and are scared to question anyone due to all Labour’s paperwork requirements if they do.

Q, I could go on and on about what this rubbish Labour regime have done to our country.
Be assured, it can not go on like this, only those too blind to see, too politically biassed or the completely ignorant are unable to see.

True, I do want things to get worse. I’m glad that Labour’s own voters are getting hit hard, no matter what propaganda Gordon spouts.
Things can only get better when things get worse and this Labour regime are removed.

If the Conservatives had done this to us I’d be campaigning to remove them.

This gives me the moral authority to judge as a completely fair and impartial observer.

.

and …. in case you have forgotten, a few months ago Cameron urged a ‘grown up’ debate on immigration. since then, he and Labour have played to the redtops. however, do you think faux stats about ATM crime would count as grown up. rather i think he had in mind a grown up discussion about our demographic timebomb – and our undeniable need for immigration.

everyone takes it as read it Phil, apart from UKIP/BNP. that’s where you, Trells, 45goat and the other immigration crazies should be. Cameron agrees with me.

So, that’s it is it, the politics ofmthe simplistic?

Route one politics, you are or you aren’t, if not then you must be. Hazel, it can’t go on this way!

You are tied to a political system which has self-interest at its heart.
I don’t need tax cuts, others do.
My country needs tax cuts, not Gordon style, take with one hand, give with the other, smack hard with stealth taxes, lies and deceit.

No, Conservatives style, managed economy, savings, business culture, low regulation, less state interefence, small business encouragament, PROPER AND HONEST tax cuts to stimulate the economy and allow people the money to choose what they wish to spend it on.

Lets not even play the immigration game for the observer.
I’m above the propaganda and only want what’s best for my country.

Please don’t label me as, Con or UKIP or BNP! This type of labelling and false loyalty has got us into the mess we’re in at the moment.

You are unable to have an honest conversation with me because of your political affiliation and false loyalty.
Though I would welcome it if you were able, beneath all the front, I do see something nice within you.

I dispair at our politically corrupt infected country.
My vane hope is that someone will rise above it all one day and rescue us.

I see no difference between what’s happenning here and what’s happenning in Zimbabwe, it’s just down to degree of damage and how fast.

.

of their wish that Macaroon will get elected, then Osbourne or some other nastier toff will take over, slash welfare (but see also Mrs Trellis’ personal manifesto re a state paid basic wage to cover gas, elec etc for EVERYONE) and slash tax at the same time.

See if you can get an appointment today.

Five years ago, I worked out that the world, ( the western world ) would inevitably face food shortages and high prices.

Complacency and short sighted policies by western Governments made the situation inevitable.

Did either of you see the danger?

I wasn’t wrong about that, and many other things too.

Britain is heading for disaster under Labour, I’m definitley NOT wrong about that!

.

Q: Don’t worry. There will be another jamboree bag along soon and Phil kean will change principles in line with the contents.
Before or after his appointment ?

Interesting to note that inflation in the Euro Zone is 3.3%, ours is so much lower, but some of the blaggers here only buy petrol and booze. so their personal inflation rates are higher, albeit temporarily.

Increasing competition over food between those with the wherewithal to pay for it will bring about greater production.

It remains very easy to eat very cheaply and well in the UK.

Take Hazel’s advice on beef btw, the greyer stuff is better, the bright red is only fit for prolonged gentle cooking, unless you keep it for a bit.

Easy to spin meat out with pulses inc lentils, bulghur wheat, w.h.y? etc, as peasants the world over, who are rather closer to food production and have more nous than UK consumers do.

i see something nice in you too. for the record, i don’t think your immigration views are in any way motivated by the kind of dark thoughts that permeate UKIP/BNP ideology. rather i think you are being misled. not because you are not intelligent, because you clearly are, but because the tabloids (Sun, Mail, Screws, Hellograph etc) are extremely pwerful in this country — and the have a bee in their bonnet.

i certainly anticipated that you would distance yourself from UKIP/BNP as you did, and for good reason. that proves ebyond doubt that your motives are sincere.

my point though is that you are cheerleading most heartily for the Tories who have ruled out tax cuts until 2015 at the earliest — as we all know, see previous blogs here on the subject — and the Tories and I and Labour are all pretty much as idem on immigration. we need it.

why then do you cheer for a party that represents my viewpoint more than your own? faute de mieux is ‘the’ theme in these parts.

especially in supermarket check-out queues.

The prices are rising on a weekly basis. Government intrusion into people’s lives and fear of crime.

Labour’s immigration and Labour’s crime ridden streets.

That’s what people are talking about, and that’s why even the most traditional of Labour voters is saying, ‘they feel ashamed they ever voted Labour in the first place’

Of course, speaking from a highly principled point of view!

.

Because there is something better.

Fine detail and proper management for all, in a better way, without bias and hypocracy.

Principle and honour must come back into politics.

Labour open up Britain to mass immigrtaion, causing those doner countries to suffer because they’ve lost their skilled workers to us.

African nations have lost doctors and engineers because they’ve come here.

China is polluting the world because we allow our businesses to open up there, using child labour sweatshops, slave wages and abuse.
This is because Gordon continually awards workers here excessive rights and conditions that Asians could only dream about.

But, I suppose Labour’s ethics have two facets, the British one and the Asian one.

Everywhere one looks we can see short-termism and hypocracy.
We are damaging our country, the world and our environment because of it.

My priority will always be the promotion of Britain’s self interest.
But, that desire is not incompatibale with being ethical and honest.

.

Whether it was a Labour or Tory government right now, I for one would not be blaming the PM for the fact that Chinese demand has driven food and commodity prices through the roof. That would be stupid.

Similarly, I would consider myself a fool is i blamed the PM, of whatever party, for a US recession creating a worldwise downturn.

Equally, it would be stupid of me to blame the PM, of whatever party, for OPEC’s hike in oil prices, or the markets decision to drive the prices further up in speculative hoarding.

These are the sources of inflation.

I would be complimentary of a PM that de-politicised interest rates and successfully targeted that scourge of savers, inflation, over the past 11 years.

immigration policy, as i have explained, is another area where ConLabLib are touch-tight. David Cameron, Gordon Brown and Nick CLegg will all tell YOU that the country is sitting on a demographic timebomb.

you are also being misled by the redtops on crime. crime is down. you would not believe that if you read the headlines in the Mail, of course. but they have an agenda and they want you to be involved in it.

only a few days ago, one of the paid Bloggers here revealed a survey in which the UK cames 8th in the world in terms of ’stability’ – well ahead of our EU and US counterparts. of course, prdictably, everyone rubbished it in rhetoric, but i did not see one competent, credible attack on its statistical conclusion.

you are living in cloud cuckoo land, pal.

you’re at it again. make your mind up – aren’t all these immigrants knocking ovr ATM machines? that was yesterday’s spin.

today they’re all doctors and engineers – sounds good to me — but no, alas, that is bad as well because we are stealing resources from other countries.

which one is it? can you see the good in anything.

for the record, everytime we steal a doctor, they remit and that pays for their next crop of people. it’s good news for everyone.

then you bemoan Chinese pollution and blame it on us?!?!?! 10% of Chinese GDP growth is entirely internal. do you not know that? they are consuming the world’s resources and creating emissions principally because they are playing catch up. their GDP will continue at 10% or so whatever happens elsewhere in the world.

and in case you didn’t know, it’s actually very hard to open a business in China because they are not a very open economy.

cloud cuckoo land.

Hazel Tree 28 Mar 2008 07:59

I posted 12 points of contention – you chose to answer only one, so I’ll claim the bonus points on the other 11.

The answer you did try to offer is full of guff. NR shares were not worth nothing – several hedge funds had been buying them and they were still being traded until the government rejected the private sector ‘bids’ and tried to take the shares for nothing (a ‘windfall’ you call it).

As for Bear Stearns – how much has shareholder Joe Lewis lost? Why has JPM had to increase its bid for the shares by a factor of 5 this week? What is the difference between loans against BS collateral by the Fed and loans against NR collateral by BoE?

You need to go and take a lesson in the markets before spouting guff on here. You pretend to know what you are talking about, but almost every post reveals that you are completely out of your depth.

I’m not surprised you chose to avoid addressing any of the other questions I asked. You simply couldn’t.

if you don’t like the exploitation of 3rd world kids – i detest it – boycott Tescos.

You are wasting your breath on that loony woman. She really hasn’t got a clue about anything.

Madness – absolute madness, woman.

What about health care for the deprived country in the meantime?

What about the cost of investment in training that person by the ‘donor’ country?

We should not be ’stealing’ doctors, nurses, teachers or any other professional worker needed by developing countries.

shouldn’t you leave the conclusions about who is answering competently. by adding it, your posts always reak of desparation.

as i said, there was NO willing buyer in the free market for NR. they all wanted a state guarantee. can i have one too? ifancy buying BP.

ergo, NR was worthless. this was the clear conclusion at the time, including in the FT. no-one – apart from those who lost out — seriously contested that it was dead.

if you think JPM are rewarding failure, don’t be fooled. it is the taxpayer that is rewarding it.

Government funding to NR is secured against UK prime assets, not US subprime, already in default, assets. if you knew anything about the asset backed market, you would understand the difference.

it’s unlikely that the Fed is even marking the collateral to market – in fact, it is almost certain that they are not because they would tell us that. MTM, they are worth a fraction of par.

instead the repo is a big sham. the tax payer is rewarding people like Jimmy Cayne, who played bridge whilst his bank went to the wall. if the Fed hadn’t supported Bear, it would be in bankruptcy. i do not understand why US taxpayers are happy subsidising Jimmy Cayne, Ace Greenberg and Joe Lewis.

our government had probably made £2.5bn+ from failed bank Northern Rock.

I think you’ll see that I said " by Western governments ", collectively, not just GB. Though I feel what he’s doing is madness.

I don’t read ‘Red Tops’, and especially the one which has helped enable eleven years of damaging Labour rule.

In fact, if you’re honest, you’ll have seen that I formulate my ideas and theories long before others start to catch on and become bold enough to speak about it.

As I’ve recently tried to point out to you of course, though it does line me up for some pretty demeaning criticism at times.

Conservative tax cuts?
Hazel, it’s about knowing. I know in my heart that the Conservatives are financially minded, historically it’s been proved.

It doesn’t matter what numbers you spout at me, I know the truth.
The only time they’ve encountered problems have been due to them taking their eye off the ball, or influenced by Labour and Libs, ( ERM ) or Maastrict, but that was the worst Con PM of all time.

Either way, they always get us back on track in the end, as witnessed by the excellent economy, pension provissions and PROPER crime levels when Labour took over in 1997.

What Lady T did re: getting us back from bankrupcy was necessary, and bold, and no-one else had the gonats to do it.

Again Hazel, try not to read too many newspaper views.
It’s far easier to speak to real people, read between the lines and work out what’s best, and not to blindly follow the party line.

I wasn’t joking the other day Hazel, though I wasn’t talking about you crossing the floor.

Labour are heading for the wilderness, and now would be a great time for someone new, and bold, to impose their identity and gather support in order to rebuild Labour’s electorially defeated leadership.

You’ve proved on these blogs that you have the courage, can you get the support?

.

1. I asked 45govt to repost the link.

2. If you are going to post soundbites / extracts from polls, please ensure that you post the source so we can evaluate the reliability of it. Interesting that only yesterday The Times was reporting that Bean had all but given up on Livingston. (Well I suppose by the law of averages Bean has to get some decisions right…..)

this is a good line Phil has dreamt up – don’t let ‘them’ in because it’s bad for them. you must have seen the story recently about the Plish doctor who drove to Scotland for the weekend to supplement his income?

do you have any idea how poor some of these countries are? do you have any idea how far a quid goes in these deprived economies? do you have the slighest clue how much difference remittances makes to, say, the Philipinnes GDP?

this is a great piece of spin, but it sadens me that you will sink to these depths, and muddy the waters in this way, just to mask your xenophobia.

"i do not understand why US taxpayers are happy subsidising …….Joe Lewis."

Go and do the research. Come back here when you understand how much Lewis has lost on Bear Stearns. The taxpayer is not subsidising him.

On NR – what is the difference between BoE providing loans to be repaid by NR and BoE providing loans to be repaid by any other UK bank?

Again, you need to go away and do the research. Then come back when you know what you are talking about.

Another myth – the Major Golden Legacy. how many times?

he left debt to GDP at 45%!!! he did this because he borrowed on a record scale. he starvd the public services. by the end, we have subContinental income inequality.

recessions, negative equity, unemloyment, inflation, boom and bust. have you any idea what the Tories actually did?

if Joe Lewis gets $10 per share rather than $2 per share for a bank that is worthless without serious Fed support, he is being subsidised. he knew as much about Bear as Jimmy Cayne. why is the taxpayer the fallguy for that billionaire? to save the system, of course, but it is a state subsidy funded from taxes.

the difference between NR and other banks is that the state owns it — all £2.5bn+ worth of it. and it was acquired for £0.

you hate it, i know, but that was a good day’s work for the taxpayer.we’ll see.

Yes Hazel, I don’t shop at Tesco, one main reason is their support for your party.

I’m against all forms of exploitation, animal, child, women, electorate.
Sadly, it’s much harder to end the exploitation of the electorate, it will have been thirteen years before we can say we’ve won that battle.

With respect, can I put this in simple terms Hazel?
I’m against allowing foreign CRIMINALS into the UK, unchecked, unregulated, free to perpetrate our present levels of crime which is forcing council tax hikes and overhwelming our police.

I’m FOR managed immigration of decent, hardworking, law abiding, tax paying, NON HEALTH TOURIST, non benefit dependant immigrants.

Hazel, can you please re-state your confusion between those two requirements?

.

talk to me about workers’ remittances! you are so very concerned about these poor poor countries, clearly, or have you decided that piece of iniquitous spin should be left to the real crazies like 45goat?!?!

Let’s not confuse this issue with raising nurses from the Phillipines.

The Polish doctor – remember Poland is in the EU – is experiencing rapid growth, rising salaries, declining unemployment – you want the stats – I went through the whole lot yesterday with a fine toothcomb so make sure you read and understand if you want to trade facts with me on this one: http://www.stat.gov.pl/gus/index_ENG_HTML.htm

The Polish doctor was being employed by an NHS Trust to provide cover since YOUR lot – Bean & Co – screwed up the out of hours contracting arrangements for GPs. Ergo, GPs got a massive pay rise and no longer had to provide continuing care for their patients. What an own goal! The out of hours payments were very high indeed in Scotland because the Trust couldn’t get cover. Hence why the Polish doctor was getting a cheap Ryanair flight over to earn a nice little bonus at weekends.

now, i can include you in the gang of David Cameron, Gordon Brown, Nick CLegg and me in terms of immigration. except we (DC,GB,NC,I) also believe that political asylum should be granted where appropriate.

now can you explain why you cheerlead so loudly for the Tories.

1. Tell me why JPM has raised its offer from $2 to $10 if the bank is worthless on the open market.

2. List the banks that are not now relying on central bank funding (any – Fed, BoE, ECB) for their continuing existence.

the point is that it pays for a doctor to travel here from Poland every weekend for a weekend’s work — because a £ goes very far in Poland. it goes even further in Kenya or Malawi or Mumbai or……

just as we import cheaper goods, we import cheaper services. its the global economy. it’s one reason why inflation has been historically low.

Q: ’some of the blaggers here only buy petrol and booze’
From some of the nonsense that I see from Trellis, kean etc it seems as though they drink the petrol.
I wonder what they do with the booze ?

Therein lies the difference between us: I don’t agree with helping myself to the assets of others. But I guess that is fair game to you socialists – anything you can get your hands on, either through taxation or nationalisation is OK by you lot, isn’t it?

Trouble is, you leave a load of casualties in the road and as often as not it includes the little man and woman as well as the big pension and investment funds (which still come back to the little man and woman, at the end of the day).

And we haven’t even touched on the abject failure of the regulator, the FSA – which has admitted failure in the case of NR.

You talk about ‘moral hazard’ and not rewarding failure. But wasn’t the failure that of the FSA – weren’t the investors entitled to rely on the government’s arrangements for bank stability?

JPM takes the first $1bn of losses, after that it’s $29bn for the taxpayer. all the upside goes to JPM.

thats’ the deal.

if JPM were buying this thing on the ‘free market’ it would take ALL the upside and ALL the downside.

Bear is worthless.

Bear has a crap balance sheet and huge contingent liabilities connectd to several funds it ran that went tits up (litigation). no-one in their right mind would touch it without a state handout. the Fed is desparately fighting of another 1930’s scale downturn. these are desparate times.

i have even heard it argued that they need inflation to deflate debt levels!

it is true that all the banks are relying upon central bank liquidity. what is unclear is how they would fare without it. they are all still trading, albeit at low levels. NR had trading suspended. everyone knew it was toast.

we got £2.5bn+ of assets for nought.

Because Labour’s record on immigration is of unregulated chaos!

Why is it that London police are struggling to cope with the crime levels?
I am in possession of letters written to me from ranking officers.

Why is it that NHS hospital maternity units are struggling to cope with the influx of foreign births.
The legal and financial implications of that will be phenomenal.

Labour are now making the ‘Managed’ common sense noises about immigration because the public rightly blame Labour for our present situation, and we’re approaching an election.

Though, it’s all lies, nothing changes, as all Labour’s past announcements on the subject turn out to be pure fabrication and spin.

I trust the Conservatives, because they are more patriotic and economically competent.

.

crime leveles are down. there are record numbers of nurses and doctors. you need to separate the tabloid headlines from the reality. they have a xenophobic agenda that borders on rascism. you even see it in the Daily Hellograph which is supposedly a broadsheet.

post that link again — park it in the Qui parle Anglais thread because no-ones interested in that one. i’ll look at it later, perhaps. this thread is getting too long for me. too much scrolling. it’ll fall off soon too.

I know what you’re saying, and it is baffling to me how one can completely ignore all the evidence of what’s going on around us.

I am looking to the possibility of emigration if Labour win again.
I see no hope for us if they’re allowed another 5 years to finnish us off.

Talk soon, must get some paperwork done now.

.

Phil kean:’I am looking to the possibility of emigration if Labour win again’
Another reason to vote Labour ?

You are a pathetic brainless twerp.

You stay here – we’re decamping to another blog.

Well done David Hughes for this blog.

How many posts needed to win the house trophy?

Dim Javidson promised us he would go if Labour got in. Funnily enough he’s still skulking round Blackpool and Bournemouth plying his tired old trade.

But that was a real vote winner for Labour.

Mrs. Trellis: ‘You are a pathetic brainless twerp’
Please do not let 45govt know. He will keep repeating it !!

Hazeltree: I somehow think that Phil ‘kean on calling people names but lacking in principles’ does not mean it either.
We live in hope !!

lots of immigrants arriving in the various parts of the Anglosphere. that’s out.

do you speak German? heck, lots of Turks piling over their borders. Spanish? Balls. They have about 10m pa piling in.

the US. Mexicans and the rest. and a big big recession.

how’s about Monaco? can you afford their prices? if so, that’s where you belong. just be sure you don’t get bored in that staid, anodyne, pointless craphole.

they’ve even got immigration in flourishing Norway, you know. and big big government. the low income inequality might not suit you though.

i would recommend Turkey. de facto low taxes because it’s all black market, secular, no-one else wants to emigrate there surely?

It sometimes pays to think before speaking.

Your opinion of Turkey is interesting, bearing in mind this Labour regime’s attempts to force their EU entry, sadly Tory policy too.

But, it highlights the sheer hypocrisy of Labour’s policy of doing things when they know full well that it is wrong.

So, does it make you happy to accuse me of xenophobia?
Cheap really Hazel and not worthy of you.
I’m sure my foreign ancestry would be baffled by your claims.

Its a sad state of affairs when legitimate concerns about the well-being of my birth country are derided and twisted to appear racist.

When I speak to you Hazel, I always hope you will give me the courtesy of straight speaking.
You quite often seem as though you are copying Gordon in his relentless efforts to turn pertinent dialogue into propaganda and electioneering.

I won’t hold it against you, I get far worse from other cowardly thugs who hide behind internet forums, though to its credit, doesn’t use a pseudonym, if indeed this is his true name.

I will go to a non EU country of course. Thoughfrom what I’m hearing, Labour are facing anihilation and will negate the need for me to seek asylum elsewhere.

.

HazelTree : I know that you will not be taken in by Phil kean’s ‘I’m sure my foreign ancestry would be baffled by your claims’
This is the same reasoning that Pfellel BoJo uses to justify his Watermelon and Piccaninies remarks.

i said before that i think you are misguided, but certainly not rascist.

there are far too may news outlets picking up the ‘all foreigners are criminals’ tales and missing the truth which is that they are predominantly hardworking. there are c700,000 unfilled vanacies in the economy. that’s potential GDP going to waste.

there is also virtually no coverage of our impending demographic timebomb. you must know the numbers. more pensioners now than kids, a reproduction rate of less than 2, a bulging middle cohort thanks only to the baby boomers.

you are, BTW, affable and entertaining; and you put the nasty, begrudging people that also cheerlead here for the Tories to shame.

i hope you and yours have a good day.

take note today of how many foreigners provide services to you. i am about to go to lunch where i will be served by Estern Europeans. they’re a bit rough round the edges, but they do their job. if they weren’t here, the resto would probably have to close. local resto prices would go up.

i might ask the foreigners in the car park to give the car a wash, though the rain’s doing a fine job of that. they’re dark skinned – no idea where they’re from. they do the exterior by hand for a fiver. much cheaper than the loacl carwash machines.

as i drive past the hospital, i’ll see if there are any foreign doctors or nurses coming or going to/from our National Health Service.

i popped in to the newsagent this am for my hardcopy of the FT. they’re first generation foreign, still have Indian accents. nice people, doing a nice job for the community.

it’s all around us Phil, and it will not and cannot be stopped by Labour, Liberal or Tory.

the criminals come in in the wash. what should we do? ask them as they enter if they intend to commit a crime? they used to ask that in NY, i remember. what will they say?

do you know anyone living in this country that does ‘not’ have foreign ancestry?

the BNP guy married that dancer. she either was half Chinese or she had a daughter that was.

i’ve never understood rascism. i am proud to say my kids are completely colour blind. they have never once mentioned the colour of another person’s skin.

we are getting better as a country, i think. just not as quickly as we should. the media are really doing an appalling job on this one.

Shall we carry on here for a while?

I see you’re persuing the Common Purpose (EU) agenda of trying to mix all the races up in the (mistaken) belief that there will never be another war if there are no national loyalties left.

You’re really just storing up shed loads of trouble for the future, and you can bet that once ‘critical mass’ is reached, some of the less tolerant religious lots will take over.

Who wants to argue about being in pure genetic line from any number of them other than 6?

I am pure bred human (honest!)

Who wants to argue about being in pure genetic line from any number of them other than 6?

I am pure bred human (honest!)

I do sometimes wonder whether microsoft IT folk can say the same though . . .

you are lucky have so meny. i have only one

But I can’t.

Evey1 and her one liner comment has made me incapable of comment.
Very funny, though I think it was an innocent line!

.

It is the racist 45% er.

Sor Wabbit (Rob U) would be more nearly elegant.

Ross Walker, RBS writing in the DT today.

It’s worth reading the whole piece.

I don’t accept anything that is in ,as you call it, Wiki’ Entries are made by people like you and it is very obvious you don’t really have a clue about anything..Stick to stats, which you say you are trained in , You can always ask Ms Hazel Nut Tree for some numbers.

you are right. it is a royal pain scrolling down this blog, as interesting as it has been. i suggest we leave the last word to me!! Lol!!

Mmmmmm, what shall it be? Think, think, think,…..

Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz.

we all did stats in my day

you should stick to horses

try a mac with safari as your browser – prob the quickest browser in the world.

zzzzzzapple

Goodbye.

If that’s where we are headed….

dunno what else is happening here mostly . . .