Comments
Do we need same approach to booze as smoking?
2009-12-19 09:13:28
There can't be many teenagers out there unaware that if a boy and a girl have unprotected sex, there is a chance of a girl getting pregnant, and/or both getting a sexually transmitted disease.
Just as there can't be too many people unaware that if you drink a lot, there is a chance of getting drunk, and if you get drunk a lot, there is a danger you become a problem to yourself and to others.
Those two rather obvious thought came into my mind when I heard someone commenting on Chief Medical Officer Liam Donaldson's recent comments on Britain's booze culture. 'We need a major public education campaign,' the commenter said.
But to do what?
Can we really say the public are uneducated about drink? Were any one of the people I saw around EC1 last night, on my way home mid-evening from a Christmas party - one guy throwing up, one group of young women staggering towards a club, a group of young men fighting - be in any doubt this morning that drink may have been a significant causal factor? I doubt it.
I have been trying to think back to the days of my own heavy drinking, which eventually helped contribute to a fullscale breakdown, and whether we were as aware then as we are now. So far as I can recall, the answer is we were generally aware, but perhaps less specifically aware. So there has been a fair bit of public education. It may have had some effect, on some individuals. But I think we'd be hard pressed to disagree with the notion that Britain still has a booze culture.
I can remember at the time of the liberalising of the licensing laws making the point on behalf of government that this was partly about trying to make Britain's attitudes to alcohol more like those of the French.
But whilst there may be more coffee bars, bistros and the like, few now make the claim that this change has worked.
Back in my boozing days, there was a lot of public education going on about smoking. It didn't stop me chainsmoking. Well, at least not until the negative effects of smoking became all too apparent, not least on my health, and I made a determined effort to stop, eventually doing so with the help of a hypnotist.
I knew when I was still smoking that it was bad for me. Ultimately the judgement to stop came from within. But who knows the extent to which the 'public education campaigns' had an effect too. So maybe the person who commented on Donaldson was right.
But ultimately the progess made on smoking has been the result of government action, much of it controversial and unpopular at the time, about labelling, pricing and finally banning.
I'm not saying for sure that we should be going down the same route for alcohol. But we're at least going to have to think about some pretty significant change, in the face of considerable public and industry opposition, if we are serious about the kind of cultural shift this issue seems to need.
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More Mr Benn and Co pleasePublish date: 2009-05-03 10:03:00
Going Fourth with JPPublish date: 2009-05-02 18:25:41
Journalism - print first, think laterPublish date: 2009-05-02 09:10:01
In praise of two poetsPublish date: 2009-05-01 10:26:36
JP hits the road againPublish date: 2009-04-29 18:52:11
My night with Eddie IzzardPublish date: 2009-04-29 10:53:25
Explaining the 50p top tax ratePublish date: 2009-04-28 09:22:53
George Best and Martin McGuinnessPublish date: 2009-04-27 09:02:35
Cameron confused over indepdendence and impartialityPublish date: 2009-04-26 12:20:56
Guide ro Marathon running part 2Publish date: 2009-04-25 11:01:34
Good signals on coal and the OlympicsPublish date: 2009-04-24 10:45:28
Tips for the London MarathonPublish date: 2009-04-23 17:29:27
Missed the Budget, saw why it matteredPublish date: 2009-04-22 23:09:31
Football good, politics bad. AllegedlyPublish date: 2009-04-22 00:00:24
The Great Wall gets greaterPublish date: 2009-04-21 09:55:22
Two sides to police storyPublish date: 2009-04-20 11:39:54
Budgets, Balls, billionaires and Susan BoylePublish date: 2009-04-19 12:31:45
Do muscles have memories?Publish date: 2009-04-18 09:44:44
Bring back standing at footballPublish date: 2009-04-17 14:50:22
When Facebook friends fall outPublish date: 2009-04-16 12:29:16
Guardian sightings and the email and bath plug agendaPublish date: 2009-04-15 11:32:16
The spin is all in the prismPublish date: 2009-04-14 09:22:41
A setback, not a crisisPublish date: 2009-04-13 12:55:19
The real lessons from Damian McBridePublish date: 2009-04-12 10:49:47
Will English always be the dominant language?Publish date: 2009-04-11 10:02:02
On the pipes and what makes a ScotPublish date: 2009-04-10 11:06:20
John Prescott lazy? NO WAYPublish date: 2009-04-09 09:11:31
David Frost is seventyPublish date: 2009-04-08 08:48:38
The Speaker, BBC2, tonight and tomorrow 8pmPublish date: 2009-04-07 14:25:31
Obama, colds and being woken by Korean missilesPublish date: 2009-04-06 11:59:24
When a call matters more than protocolPublish date: 2009-04-05 11:33:42
Green Cities Champions LeaguePublish date: 2009-04-04 10:19:53
Could Cameron have delivered the G20 deal?Publish date: 2009-04-03 10:11:59
Of Benn and BonoPublish date: 2009-04-02 08:21:16
Memo to Sarko - allez vite a LondresPublish date: 2009-04-01 08:46:17
Happy April Fool's DayPublish date: 2009-04-01 01:44:05
Eurostar, Le Monde and a thought for the G20 sherpasPublish date: 2009-03-31 09:17:22
Why Kevin Rudd made an impactPublish date: 2009-03-30 10:24:41
Pre-G20 hype matters less than post-G20 processPublish date: 2009-03-29 13:17:28
The Damned UnitedPublish date: 2009-03-28 10:37:04
A hobby horse, a plug and a bit of sportPublish date: 2009-03-27 10:22:23
Cloughie - he had a lot to be big-headed aboutPublish date: 2009-03-26 09:38:36
A sad sight of the old fearing the youngPublish date: 2009-03-25 17:03:07
Post-modern, post-structural, or bullshit?Publish date: 2009-03-25 08:18:02
Learning the right lessons from ObamaPublish date: 2009-03-24 08:53:15
Lazy Dave needs to keep an eye on lazy KenPublish date: 2009-03-23 11:16:14
Farewell favourite restaurant, hello hometownPublish date: 2009-03-22 08:18:09
Dave, Danny and have the Tories really changed?Publish date: 2009-03-21 08:55:13
Life beyond Dover ...Publish date: 2009-03-20 10:11:21
My friends in The New Statesman - Fergie, Fiona, Tony, Sarah, Kevin, 'Dacre,' and a great GB idea for the G20Publish date: 2009-03-18 10:38:22
Iraq, Iran, GB, Obama and diplomatic chessPublish date: 2009-03-17 10:07:13
The Age of StupidPublish date: 2009-03-16 08:27:13
Is all change good?Publish date: 2009-03-15 10:00:06
The pressure of being a post-modern sex godPublish date: 2009-03-14 10:00:55
Cameron still hasn't sealed the deal with businessPublish date: 2009-03-13 09:21:49
Stand up for social workersPublish date: 2009-03-12 08:31:17
Surely Malcolm Tucker could have told Armando Ianucci ... You can't spin a spinnerPublish date: 2009-03-11 10:58:25
Start of a new approach from Labour?Publish date: 2009-03-10 09:54:12
A peace process still strongPublish date: 2009-03-09 08:21:05
Day of destiny for the real footballer of the yearPublish date: 2009-03-08 09:21:06
Private advice to Peggy Mitchell - the leaked note in fullPublish date: 2009-03-07 08:17:21
Boris, the Tories and the tummy-tickling poodle pressPublish date: 2009-03-06 09:49:37
A day in the life of the self-obsessed TV reporterPublish date: 2009-03-05 07:55:47
GB - good speech, well deliveredPublish date: 2009-03-04 19:31:05
Notes on the environment, a role in EastEndersPublish date: 2009-03-04 10:58:56
She may be my 'wife' but it is time to rebut!Publish date: 2009-03-03 10:52:59
Some speeches matter more than othersPublish date: 2009-03-02 12:04:45
Mental health and the Carling Cup FinalPublish date: 2009-03-01 09:08:17
Inside the chocolate factoryPublish date: 2009-02-28 10:23:59
GB on the G20, JP on Jeremy KylePublish date: 2009-02-27 09:14:36
Charity and the credit crunch, please give generously!Publish date: 2009-02-26 08:55:12
Why oh why are the Tories not home and dry?Publish date: 2009-02-24 09:44:59
Me, Dermot and ten top songsPublish date: 2009-02-23 10:02:19
Names round-upPublish date: 2009-02-22 08:43:39
What's in a name?Publish date: 2009-02-21 09:58:14
Editing the New StatesmanPublish date: 2009-02-20 11:42:36
Salute Peter M’s proper use of the F wordPublish date: 2009-02-19 09:58:58
Labour's communications challenge for the NHSPublish date: 2009-02-18 10:34:39
In praise of KeighleyPublish date: 2009-02-17 14:33:57
A night at the EmiratesPublish date: 2009-02-17 00:06:51
When marriage is testedPublish date: 2009-02-16 13:36:35
Spare me the myths and the whiningPublish date: 2009-02-15 13:29:50
Dave Cameron - is that all there is?Publish date: 2009-02-14 11:11:55
Boris Johnson: F is for ...Publish date: 2009-02-13 07:55:10
The Cameron vacuumPublish date: 2009-02-12 14:48:33
Lincoln, Obama, Blair and the 24 hour media culturePublish date: 2009-02-11 10:28:47
Eighteen interviews later ...Publish date: 2009-02-10 19:24:45
Time to talk about Time to Change on NewsnightPublish date: 2009-02-09 22:47:49
So that’s what they mean by online community?Publish date: 2009-02-08 12:12:51
First blogPublish date: 2009-02-05 15:23:57
Robert Jackson
2009-12-24 20:19:01The Late Barbara Castle was crucified by the tippling motorist for introducing the breath test and it's taken 40 years to get where we are now.
This the stuff of politics and it's tough.
Good article, Alastair. This is what separates the parties. Inheritance Tax breaks for the wealthy and wittering on about a "Broken Society" or doing something about the root causes of poverty, broken homes, ill health and early avoidable death.
Vision to drive the right agenda.
It's tough and it's right.
Chris
2009-12-23 12:34:05I'd save revolution for the important stuff, Sean. Or if getting pissed is the important stuff to you, perhaps adjust your priorities.
Sean O'Hare
2009-12-22 16:41:31What right have governments (of either party) got to dictate to people what they shall and shall not drink or where and when they can smoke? In case you have forgotten Alastair, governments work for the people not the other way around. Just tell Brown and the rest of them to get off our backs or one day you will find you have pushed just a little too far and the people turn. That wouldn't be pretty would it?
Elliott Burton
2009-12-22 11:00:51No, because they are fundamentally different. With smoking, you can take it down to the level where you can say smoking even 1, single cigarette is bad for you. You simply cant say that with alcohol, in fact, alcohol in moderation is actually good for you, especially with drinks like red wine. Teetotallers die younger, a proven fact.
Nick
2009-12-22 10:55:16No. This fag- end of a Labour Government needs to stop dictating to people how they lead their lives.
Chris
2009-12-21 13:06:13No.
And while we're there, legalise weed and promote reformed taxation on substance use and abuse. Let's start taking some responsibility for our own lives and our own choices, and start raising funding for doing so.
We all pay high premiums into a system where risk is more adequately covered than in the private sector, where we pay lower premiums but end up with a trade-off in access to care.
So bearing in mind those high premiums, cover the risk by building NHS infrastructure on new taxation models that include behaviours that people participate in anyway.
Inform, educate, choose.
Helen
2009-12-19 23:54:06I'm a little confused.
In your penultimate paragraph you state "the progress made on smoking". What progress do you mean? The latest government intervention on smoking has stopped in its tracks the steady downward decline of smoking prevalence and smoking take-up.
Smoking prevalence had reduced year on year for decades before anti-smoking legislation was introduced. We are now seeing a reverse of this decline.
If you want to reduce drinking and smoking, you have to remove draconian techniques which people will always rebel against. Both substances are legal and are highly taxed. If you want to receive the tax off these products then you should ensure that you cater correctly and poline correctly, those who indulge.
Bullying will not work with alchohol, as the majority of people enjoy the odd tipple.
Bullying is ongoing against our legal smokers (instead of solutions introduced to cater for all our legal citizens) and the labour party is so obviously receiving the silent treatment from its core voters.
You may wish for a country full of puritans, but I say that variety is the spice of life.
C Burke
2009-12-19 23:02:23Living in London will give you the lungs of a smoker anyway due to the terrible air quality. We don't see the gov pushing to ban 4x4s and trucks.
olli issakainen
2009-12-19 15:52:29I am glad to hear that you have stopped smoking. I have never smoked, and I am also a teetotaller.
But why do people smoke and drink too much in the first place as it is nowadays clear that these habits are harmful to you? Why do they prefer short-term pleasure to long-term gains? It is not a wise thing to do, but even many intelligent people do it.
RTS
2009-12-19 15:26:09I'm still trying to work out at what point the government decided my health was their concern - beyond keeping me informed.
If people want to drink then surely the quantity is entirely THEIR business and only becomes the state's business when it starts to effect other people i.e fights in town centres and domestic violence.
Providing taxation is set to cover costs to the NHS and costs of make the public aware then the government's job is done.
Anything beyond this is force, be it minimum pricing or other legislation, and forced aimed at protecting people from themselves. Really? Is that what MPs think they were elected to do?
Last thought for you Alastair. How would feel about me stepping in to protect you from yourself because I've decided I know better?
Em
2009-12-19 13:34:27I knew you'd write this blog one day.
You don't exactly argue for legislation in your last paragraph and yet... of course, you don't pursue your initial analogy and say how "we're at least going to have to think about some pretty significant change" when it comes to sex... thank God for that.
I love alcohol. Love it — and somehow I never manage to drink more than one or two units per day. I'm not talking about an average that means seven units on Fridays and Saturdays, I mean one to two units most days. Maybe it's because I'm French and my parents allowed me a drink on special occasions and even when I was very little, they made me mocktails. I know this line of thinking is controversial but one thing for sure, alcohol was never taboo for me and I'd never use it consciously or unconsciously as a means of rebellion. And if I'd had a visceral, chemical reaction to alcohol, my parents would have noticed it.
But back to smoking: my drinking one unit of alcohol per day does not affect the health of those around me whereas moderate smoking would have a cumulative effect on those around me. That is why the state had to intervene.
UK governments are enthusiastic enough about "looking after" their citizens is so many ways, I sincerely think you've got the ground covered. Let us preserve the few civil liberties we have left.
And last night... a person heaving is, I understand, very unpleasant but "girl staggering towards a club"? This is 2009. Women are able to take care of themselves and don't need the state to tell them how ladies should behave.
By the way... it's Christmas. People party.
Colin Morley
2009-12-19 12:22:20Just as a coma finally made Shibley stop drinking, so Legionnaire's Disease stopped me from smoking. But we can't arrange a trauma for every addict to find his 'road to Damascus'. You can only educate so far and after that unless you legislate you get nowhere, which will always be a huge dilemma for those of liberal mind. Maybe we need to re-read John Stuart Mill and unilitarianism to agree that even for those of us who enjoy a drink, excessive drinking is damaging the whole country and we should act according to the country's best interests and not always our own. Living in France I can attest to the difference in social attitudes to alcohol - but alcoholism in France is a very serious problem - it just isn't made public all the time. Drunkenness and alcoholism stay indoors but are just as damaging to the health service, the economy and the general wellbeing of this lovely country
Judith Haire
2009-12-19 12:05:21I am tee total but realise that people will drink if they want to, whatever the government says or does. Supermarkets should be banned from selling cases of drink at very low prices and the price of alcohol in pubs should be increased.All advertising of alcohol should be banned. Alcohol is poison, it's a depressant and it artifically alters the mood; any new campaigns should highlight the harsh reality and the unpleasant facts about alcohol and try to dissuade people from drinking to get drunk. And most importantly, look at the reasons why people drink to get drunk.
Shibley
2009-12-19 11:04:17It was very helpful to me for you to share your experiences of suffering from an alcohol problem. I share your concern that the quick fix of educating the public sounds good, but may not actually be the solution. I suppose that people treat this as an urgent problem. Sir Liam Donaldson may wish to see results before he goes early next year.
I used to suffer from a massive drink problem, and it ruined my life in every conceivable way. Since my two month coma in 2007 (unrelated as it happens; it was due to meningitis), I have not touched a drop. I don't even like the sight or smell of the stuff. However, I don't harbour any hostility to it; I wish people who can enjoy alcohol my very best wishes. It just that I couldn't.
I can't stop if I have a drink. That's why I don't touch a drop. This is clearly abnormal - pathological - call it what you will. But I am genuinely concerned for people who have the same problem as me, but they don't realise it. With an increasing amount of people drinking overall, only a handful more people who could have their lives ruined.
Whilst I have always been in a drinking culture, particularly at Cambridge, nobody forced me to drink. My parents do not drink because they are Muslim. Where I think that Sir Liam Donalson might have a valid point is better eeducation on when somebody normal becomes a problem drinker, and then becomes an alcohol. I don't think I understood this, nor did my parents, until it was too late.
So I find the issue of alcohol and the public a very emotive one. However, I admire you Alastair for speaking out on the dangers of it. However, I don't deny that there are many who enjoy a drink perfectly innocent. In some ways, I wish still I were one of them, but I have moved on my times 'just for today'. I genuinely have deleted it from my life.
I do share people's concerns, that once an alcohol, always an alcoholic, but that makes me doubly viligant. For me, if I have another drop, I fear I will die. I don't want to turn my comment into a public health broadcast, like the one that has been banned from You Tube. It's just that I want to share my support for you Alastair and also talking elsewhere on the link between alcoholism and mental illness. I remember that Christmas parties were always a difficult time for me. However, remembering the images of people throwing up around Clerkenwell Road easily negate that now.
Steven Calder
2009-12-19 10:23:39It's great that you've came out in support of the SNP on policy again Alistair, well done for not treating this issue as a partisan one.
Good luck at the inquiry, I'm sure you'll do well.
Quietzapple
2009-12-19 10:14:00I too gave up smoking when it was apparent it would kill me otherwise with enormous difficulties. My 20st pink haired Dr had acupuncture training in China, my ear remains, but at the time I felt as though she was removing it.
The silly carping by the tobacco lobby about the destructiveness of smoking tobacco was never up to much, surely? It has been apparent since the 1960s than any smoking is inimical to health.
Alcohol is not a good parallel. The extent to which it damages whose health at various levels of consumption is disputed, and not solely by the brewers and distillers.
It may be that strategies like taking a month off from drinking should be promoted more, but this may not be the best time for such a promotion.
In view of the appalling furore about Prof Nutt's apparent promotion of "soft" drugs the climate doesn't look propitious, does it?
Julia
2009-12-19 09:30:56I'm quite hard-line on alcohol because coming from a different country (and not one where drinking is exactly frowned upon), I happen to think that the UK's problems with alcohol are actually about four times worse than everybody says...
Up here in Scotland, Labour have just come out against minimum pricing for alcohol for various reasons but I have to admit, I wouldn't be at all opposed to us coming up with another way of making alcohol more expensive.
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